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Results 21 to 30 of 31
  1. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    that helped a lot, though I am still kinda wondering if it could be done depending on what gender they were. Like what if you had 2 female gbr and 2 male agassizi? or would there still be a territory issue there? Im not looking for them to hybrid or breed atall, I just think a tank with both species would look amazing. Maybe depending on the specific fishes nature if i could find a mellow pair of agassizi, or is it more about territory making fish act out
    cuz my gold ram is probably the most sweetest fish I've ever seen

  2. #22

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ras View Post
    that helped a lot, though I am still kinda wondering if it could be done depending on what gender they were. Like what if you had 2 female gbr and 2 male agassizi? or would there still be a territory issue there? Im not looking for them to hybrid or breed atall, I just think a tank with both species would look amazing. Maybe depending on the specific fishes nature if i could find a mellow pair of agassizi, or is it more about territory making fish act out
    cuz my gold ram is probably the most sweetest fish I've ever seen
    Two males of any species will argue, as each will want "his" territory. The female rams might be OK on their own, but how the male Apisto would treat them, not sure. I've never mixed these as I don't think it wise to do so.

    If the ram is doing well, I would not upset her. Sometimes it is best to leave well enough alone.
    Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
    Vancouver, BC, Canada

    Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]

  3. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Byron View Post
    Two males of any species will argue, as each will want "his" territory. The female rams might be OK on their own, but how the male Apisto would treat them, not sure. I've never mixed these as I don't think it wise to do so.

    If the ram is doing well, I would not upset her. Sometimes it is best to leave well enough alone.
    yea, after little bit of internet searching I don't think I'm going to try this either,
    I found this video

    and if this is what is considered a "peaceful" tank I think I'll pass, that looks horrible for the poor apistos,
    I'd rather just setup my old 50gal tank and have both species with their own homes
    just thought having two aquariums might be over the top, but tbh I'll probably have like 4 within 2 years...fish are addicting

  4. #24

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    0 Not allowed!
    I'm glad you found and posted that video. That is exactly what i was referring to when i said that more than one species of dwarf cichlid should not be housed together. As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words. And things may look rather calm there, but the continual harassment like that usually leads to the death of the fish being harassed, within a matter of weeks.

    Another thing is noticeable in that video, and that is the continual upper level positioning of the Apistogramma. That is or should be a clue that something is wrong. Apistogramma like the rams are substrate-level fish; they naturally remain close to the substrate, they feed off the substrate. When you see them in the upper level, you know something is wrong. It could be water quality but here it is undoubtedly the harassment from the rams.

    I see other issues in that tank too, but that is another topic.

    Byron.
    Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
    Vancouver, BC, Canada

    Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]

  5. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    what do you think about Apistogramma borellii in a non breeding tank with gbr
    http://www.azgardens.com/p-776-apist...i-cichlid.aspx
    this here says they are really peaceful but I don't have any experience with that
    think it would still be a problem?

  6. #26

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    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ras View Post
    what do you think about Apistogramma borellii in a non breeding tank with gbr
    http://www.azgardens.com/p-776-apist...i-cichlid.aspx
    this here says they are really peaceful but I don't have any experience with that
    think it would still be a problem?
    "Peaceful" can be applied to many dwarf cichlids; none are really aggressive in the way some of the larger species can be. But this generally refers to having the dwarfs in a community setup, where they will generally leave other fish alone. But cichlid in with cichlid is a different story, as that video shows. The ram is not going to care if it is a "peaceful" dwarf like A. borellii or another, it is still a cichlid and that means an intruder into the ram's space. I would not combine cichlids of different species.

    Before someone mentions it, angelfish and rams can work, but here we are dealing with a cichlid of quite different behaviours in the angelfish; they are not substrate-level fish, so they are not actively intruding into the dwarf's (ram or apisto) space. Most aquarists have had success combining angels and rams. But again, I do not recommend two "dwarf" species together, unless the tank is very large in area, and even 4 feet in my experience does not fit this criteria.

    Byron.
    Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
    Vancouver, BC, Canada

    Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]

  7. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    I see, that makes sense. I actually noticed this morning my gold ram pecked at one of my other fish for the first time that I know of.. It was a cory and they were both trying to go for the same pellet on the floor and the ram was fine for a few seconds then out of no where he pecked the cory right in the gill x.x figuring its because of what you mentioned about another substrate level fish posing a threat
    should I not have cory's with my rams? or are they ok
    the ram doesn't continually chase him or bully him, just when feeding comes around hes kind of pushy

    and tbh I would never mix rams with angels, Ive seen some vicious angel fish ... brutal stuff..
    the lfs had a pack of like 7 angels in a 10 gallon tank with a school of rummy nose tetras.. if the tetras didnt stay moving they were eaten . Kinda turned me off to the idea of angel fish even though I heard it depends on the specific fish, I guess some are really friendly


    soooo how many rams can you have in one community without them killing each other? again they dont have to be different gender as I'm not looking to breed.

    and this is probably a REALLY stupid question but here goes. I notice sometimes when i look over at the fish or when I walk into the room where the tank is my ram will come and press up against the glass and push his head into it like hes trying to get out. I thought this was something bad like the water was bad quality or something but Im starting to notice he doesn't do it when Im not looking. For example if he doesnt see me looking at him, he wont do it, he will just chill and peck around the sand floor of the tank
    but once we catch eyes or he sees my body move or anything he will start doing it SO I did a little looking online and it said some cichlids like to "greet" people ? is that a real thing or is that something they say to get people to buy fish lol
    Last edited by Ras; 10-24-2013 at 09:40 PM.

  8. #28

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    I see, that makes sense. I actually noticed this morning my gold ram pecked at one of my other fish for the first time that I know of.. It was a cory and they were both trying to go for the same pellet on the floor and the ram was fine for a few seconds then out of no where he pecked the cory right in the gill x.x figuring its because of what you mentioned about another substrate level fish posing a threat
    should I not have cory's with my rams? or are they ok
    the ram doesn't continually chase him or bully him, just when feeding comes around hes kind of pushy
    This is fairly common. My Bolivian Ram does much the same thing; and interestingly he dislikes the spotted species of cory much more than the others. But aside from just nudging the cory out of the way, I have never seen any physical damage, and the cory will turn around and push right back in, so I don't worry about this. I would if I saw the Ram actually chasing another fish through the tank, that is very different; but this has never occurred.

    This is also something that Apistos will do when guarding eggs or fry; corys are naturally inquisitive, always poking everywhere for food. Every species of Apisto I have had has taken a dislike to corys for this reason. And it is not unfounded. Back in the mid 1990's i had a pair of Blue Rams in my 90g, and a group of 20-30 corys. The rams spawned, and the eggs hatched; I never did see the eggs, just the shoal of fry being shepherded through the tank by the female, so they must have been laid somewhere out of range of the corys. Anyway, one day I was sitting in front of the tank, when 2 or 3 corys just happened to come into the fry shoal. Within seconds the fry were gone, it was a real feeding frenzy. The female tried to protect them by poking at the corys, but they were too many and too determined. If you do want dwarf cichlids to spawn and the fry to survive, do not breed them in a tank with bottom fish.

    and tbh I would never mix rams with angels, Ive seen some vicious angel fish ... brutal stuff..
    the lfs had a pack of like 7 angels in a 10 gallon tank with a school of rummy nose tetras.. if the tetras didnt stay moving they were eaten . Kinda turned me off to the idea of angel fish even though I heard it depends on the specific fish, I guess some are really friendly
    Angelfish are predators by nature, and should never be combined with linear characins like rummys, neons, glowlights, etc. The rounder disk-shaped species fare OK, like Rosy Tetra. But angelfish do have the temperament of a cichlid, so one has to be careful.

    soooo how many rams can you have in one community without them killing each other? again they dont have to be different gender as I'm not looking to breed.
    The two ram species are best in bonded pairs, or in the case esp of the Bolivian, a single fish. Bonded means the male and female accept each other and bond, usually for life. If they don't, they may spawn, even several times, but at some point the male may well decide to kill the female. I had this occur with my Bolivian, back before I was aware of the bonded aspect.

    Males will certainly establish territories, and the amount of damage done to one or more depends upon the fish and the environment. Females I have always assumed would not be so problematic, but recently other members have mentioned this is not always the case.

    Many cichlids, perhaps all species, also bond. This is why some Apisto species are recommended to be kept in a harem, with one male and 2-4 females. The male will select his mate, and the others will not usually suffer his displeasure, though this is not a certainty. Space, the aquascape, and other fish are factors in this too.

    and this is probably a REALLY stupid question but here goes. I notice sometimes when i look over at the fish or when I walk into the room where the tank is my ram will come and press up against the glass and push his head into it like hes trying to get out. I thought this was something bad like the water was bad quality or something but Im starting to notice he doesn't do it when Im not looking. For example if he doesnt see me looking at him, he wont do it, he will just chill and peck around the sand floor of the tank
    but once we catch eyes or he sees my body move or anything he will start doing it SO I did a little looking online and it said some cichlids like to "greet" people ? is that a real thing or is that something they say to get people to buy fish lol
    I suspect the fish are recognizing you as the provider of food. And once they learn that you are also not a threat, they will be more interactive.

    Byron.
    Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
    Vancouver, BC, Canada

    Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]

  9. #29

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    I have to disagree about the angel and rummys. Rummys are often recommended as OK with angels. I have 9 rummynose in with my single angel at the moment and they have been together over two years now. This angel was originally the male of a pair that spawned several times until I lost the female about 6 months ago. My rummys stay pretty close to the bottom of the tank along with some cories and I have never seen any aggression from the angels toward them. But I suppose others could have a different experience than mine.

  10. #30

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by SueD View Post
    I have to disagree about the angel and rummys. Rummys are often recommended as OK with angels. I have 9 rummynose in with my single angel at the moment and they have been together over two years now. This angel was originally the male of a pair that spawned several times until I lost the female about 6 months ago. My rummys stay pretty close to the bottom of the tank along with some cories and I have never seen any aggression from the angels toward them. But I suppose others could have a different experience than mine.
    Linear fish are easy prey for angelfish. Having said that, the particular fish, the environment, the aquascaping all factor in to how fish behave. All we can do is assume the majority behaviour, while recognizing that sometimes it is different.

    From your post, I assume the angelfish was relatively small, as a juvenile perhaps, and the rummys may have been mature and settled. This would be quite a different scenario.

    Byron.
    Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
    Vancouver, BC, Canada

    Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]

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