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07-12-2012, 07:58 PM #1
Mystery snails - thrive in 30 gal die in 5 gal
Got a question. I have 2 mystery snails in my 30 gal community tank that are thriving.
At the same time I bought them, I bought 2 for my 5 gallon (betta) tank.
Both snails in the 5 gal died within 2 weeks of purchase. This is the second time I've tried snails in the 5 gal - first time they died too.
I drip acclimated for both tanks.
Use same water source/ Prime conditioner
Water perimeters in both fully cycled and stable tanks are: A - 0, NI - 0, NA 10 - 30, PH 6.4
I do wkly 65% W/C in both tanks.
Anyone have any ideas what might be the problem with the 5 gallon?
Thanks so much!
07-12-2012, 08:16 PM #2
The only thing that I can think of that might be making a difference is the oxygen level in the 5g. Did you notice if the snails were around the top of the 5g tank most of the time?Three-fourths of the Earth's surface is water, and one-fourth is land. It is quite clear that the good Lord intended us to spend triple the amount of time fishing as taking care of the lawn. ~Chuck Clark
07-12-2012, 10:22 PM #3
Seems like they might have hung around at the top most of the time - definitely, they were floating when we realized they were dead. :o(
I have 2 filters on that tank - a small tetra whisper for a 10 gallon and a submerged filter for a 10 gal. Seems to be plenty of water flow.
But maybe I should get an air bubbler?
thanks so much for answering.
07-13-2012, 02:45 AM #4
Could be the air flow, a bubbler might help, but the Betta may not like it much. Its also possible that since it is a different tank, there may be traces of copper leeching into the tank somehow. Has any inhabitant been medicated in this tank prior? Was it brand new when you bought it? Some medications contain copper or other chemicals that are hazardous to snails, and can get impregnated into the tank silicone and released later.2 10 gallon tanks, 1 20 gallon tank, 1 Fluval Edge, 1 29 gallon tank, and one backyard pond.
07-13-2012, 07:31 AM #5
Tiari has brought up a really good possibilty here! I never gave that a thought!
If the left over medication isn't the case, and before you put a bubbler in and risk upsetting your Betta, we should probably look at how your filters are set up.
Couple of questions. Has your submersible got a little spray bar on it, or did it come with one? And is the tank filled all the way up to the Whispers overflow, so that the water is just kind of pushing its way back into the tank, or is the water falling a little way back into the tank - kind of splashing a little? What I'm getting at, is that if you can break or agitate the water surface a little more, then that will allow more oxygen into the water. So if the submersible has a little spray bar on it, you could possible turn it, so that the little holes are pointing to the water surface. And/or, you might be able to drop the level of the tank water a bit, to make the water fall into the tank a little, when it comes back out of the Whisper.Three-fourths of the Earth's surface is water, and one-fourth is land. It is quite clear that the good Lord intended us to spend triple the amount of time fishing as taking care of the lawn. ~Chuck Clark
07-15-2012, 03:44 AM #6
Thanks to both of you.
And yes to the medication/copper question. I used Coppersafe once almost 3 months ago on some neons that showed signs of ick (then I moved them to the 30 gal after 30 days). After so many W/C, (weekly 65 - 70%) is it possible that trace amounts of the Coppersafe is still in the tank/filter media/filter?
If so, new carbon to get it out? I haven't changed or added carbon since.
Or would I have to take more drastic steps? Hate to mess with my filter media as the tank is so stable but I could scoop out all the gravel and the betta's hollow log and clean it.
What do you think?
As for the filters: No spray bar on the submersible. Tank is full to the top and no water fall or splashing. That's concerned me a bit but the betta seems to be thriving so I haven't done anything about it.
I can change that though by lifting the submersible a bit and repositioning it to create a bit of a water fall affect/splash. Makes perfect sense. I should do it anyway, regardless of the copper issue.
I don't want to try more snails, however, until I hear back from either or both of you regarding the copper - and if you think it might still be in the tank and if so, how to get rid of it.
07-15-2012, 08:10 AM #7
I'm glad that we could get to the bottom of that. Tiari has cracked the case!
To get the left over meds out, get rid of the old carbon, if there's any in your filter, and add some new stuff. Run it in the filter for about 1 - 2 weeks, but keep doing your water changes and gravel vacs too. After 1 - 2 weeks remove the carbon again, and everything should be ok!Three-fourths of the Earth's surface is water, and one-fourth is land. It is quite clear that the good Lord intended us to spend triple the amount of time fishing as taking care of the lawn. ~Chuck Clark
07-15-2012, 01:20 PM #8
Great. thanks. I appreciate it.
I think I'll still readjust the submersible filter so there's a little water falling on the surface - can't hurt to add more oxygen. If Betta Blue (aka Turbo) gets upset, I'll readjust again.
You guys are great!
07-15-2012, 01:39 PM #9
This caught my attention because similar happened to me the other night. Now, I think shrimp are mighty tough critters. I have dipped plants in bleach water and find shrimp swimming around in that water that were hiding in the plants. They have managed to survive in there for several minutes, too, while I search for the net and scooped them out. (I also have hundreds of shrimp so never in much of a hurry.)
BUT, last week I decided to move several to my 5 gallon tank. I set the tank up, used the Prime, added a small whisper filter and a bubbler. I also noticed several of them hanging at the top, which I never see, but I ignored it and went to bed.
In the morning, half were alive and half were dead. Maybe 30 were dead. The only thing that I could think of was either the gases in the water or the Prime did not remove the chloramines as fast as I thought it should have.
I also tend to use more Prime than necessary, as well. I don't believe it should have been the Prime but I just don't know what caused this because these shrimp go thru a lot around here. I'm constantly sucking them up with my vac, dumping them back into the water, moving them tank to tank, etc. I have never had die offs no matter what I do to them.......until this.
07-15-2012, 11:19 PM #10
If you used copper-safe, this is exactly what is killing your snails. Copper will become impregnated into the silicone, AND, the decorations, rocks plants and all that, even the filter. It will continue to leech out quite possibly in minute amounts forever.
One thing you can try is a product by Seachem called Cuprisorb. I had to order it online, no stores I have found carry it. It is a substance that removes leeching copper from a tank and is placed in the filter. I do not know if it fully removes copper, or just makes a tank tainted with it liveable while it is in use. I have used it in one tank after a treatment of coppersafe, but do not have anything else in it but a Betta.2 10 gallon tanks, 1 20 gallon tank, 1 Fluval Edge, 1 29 gallon tank, and one backyard pond.