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Results 1 to 10 of 24
  1. Default Why don't loaches do well in salt and what consequences?


    0 Not allowed!
    Hey,

    Have read lots of info on how loaches and other sensitive fish "do not do well with salt" added into the aquarium, yet no explanation as to WHY do not do well or what harm they could possibly experience. And often the websites or forums say they can tolerate only small amounts of salt, "but watch for signs of stress", yet no explanation of what activity constitues a sign of distress! Yet I can see why some might choose to use salt added to the aquarium, in smaller doses, rather than other medications as the choice of the lesser of two evils.

    Maybe I am just looking for more information than necessary, but I can't find anywhere where it explains WHY certain "sensitive' or "scaleless" fish do not take salt well. Are they sensitive in that they don't have scales to protect them? Or sensitive in breathing or their tolerance to water parameters or what????

    How can/does salt harm them? What happens to them? How to know if they show signs of stress if don't know what signs to look for? Especially the loaches. These guys can go from motionless and barely breathing and scare you are they dead to spastic rubber bands flying all over the tank and rapid breathing. I see a wide variety in the way their coloring can appear and yet be normal also.

    So what would I look for as signs of stress due to salt?

    P.S> There is no salt in the tank now. Just asking for future reference.
    50 gal - finally fish! 11 pangio kuhli loaches, 10 neon tetras, 4 zebra danios, 3 cherry barbs, 3 guppies
    10 gal - temporarily closed
    5 gal - temporarily closed

    Proverbs 11:14 & 15:22 -- Thanks for your help!

  2. #2

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Loaches are scaleless fish, hence they're more sensitive to the absorption of salt than fish with scales.

    I see no reason to add salt to a healthy aquarium. I've always felt that if one is going to have salt in an aquarium, they should set up a brackish or saltwater tank. A freshwater tank is freshwater.

    The signs of stress in a loach depends on the species as well as general signs of stress that go for all of them -- they stop eating (especially dojo loaches, which are normally voracious eaters), their color fades, they're chronically listless when before they were active, they develop signs of disease on their skin, they begin swimming oddly or laying sideways or upside down on the substrate -- all these symptoms are signs of stress.

    My personal policy -- no salt, ever. Simply not necessary and I don't think it's really good for most freshwater fish. Some possible exceptions might be mollies or even guppies, if they're acclimated slowly and carefully -- but why do it in a freshwater tank?

    -- mermaidwannabe
    20 gal. high: planted; 8 white cloud minnows, 10 RCS, 2 blue shrimp, several snails; AC50, Azoo air. 65 gal: planted; 7 rosy barbs, 6 glofish,, 2 zebra danios, 6 rosy red (fathead) minnows, 3 dojo loaches, several snails; AC110 x 2.

  3. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aqua...highlight=salt
    Read through this,maybe it will help understand and maybe not. Very often advice such as what you refer to is simple regergataion or parroting and the giver has no first hand experiance with the subject at hand. Gb has a fairly decent write up in the provided link.
    As for loaches being especially sensitive to salt I really dont know if thats true or not. It is also said that they are more sensitive to meds like ich meds,I can say from actual experiance that has not proved true in my use of ich med. I keep a large amount of "scaleless" fish and have used meds several times at full strength with no loss of any scaleless life. To be honest salt is a feel good med touted by lfs to sell salt. It has no use as a thereapeutic additive and minimal use as a ich fighter if used correctly and later removed through large water changes.
    Last edited by smaug; 05-05-2012 at 12:52 AM.

  4. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Well that was without a doubt interesting and contradictory to other research! Well worth the read. Thanks!
    50 gal - finally fish! 11 pangio kuhli loaches, 10 neon tetras, 4 zebra danios, 3 cherry barbs, 3 guppies
    10 gal - temporarily closed
    5 gal - temporarily closed

    Proverbs 11:14 & 15:22 -- Thanks for your help!

  5. #5

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    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Salt has no place in the average fresh water aquarium (standard fish and good conditions.) That said, it is very useful if nitrites are non-zero. For discus, it can be a great life saver and all around tonic. Has a use for ick but why?? Meds are far better. Mollies (wild) can use it but tank breed don't really require it. Also, with open wounds on the fish salt could be helpful (again, meds might work better here - open call) but I'd be careful with it.
    Last edited by Cermet; 05-05-2012 at 11:11 AM.

  6. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Bigger water changes and good grqvel maint are the best tonic for nitrates.

  7. #7

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    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Cermet, I see no reason to put salt in a freshwater tank. Prevention is the best medicine and most problems can be prevented with clean water. There should not be nitrites in a properly maintained tank, and if there were, bringing in clean water through water changes does just as much if not more than salt. IME (<- that's for Smaug ), I had ich in one of my tanks one time and I used quick cure ich meds. All signs of ich were gone with in two days. Of course I completed the treatment for longer but I see no reason to force my fish to suffer through high temps and the skin irritation of salt to speed up the lifecycle of ich when medicine is so much faster and water changes are so soothing to the fish. Wild caught molly's do well in freshwater as well, I have some in my tank and they were caught in a freshwater creek near my home as fry and have grown nicely in my tank and breed quite often. In fact nearly every river here has molly's. As a euryhdine species they are highly adaptive to varying salinity, but they absolutely do not need salt in their water. On to open wounds, again clean water is the best medicine. I have a group of wild caught texas cichlids that are constantly scraping themselves on rocks during their attempts to redecorate their home and from the occasional territorial scuffle. These wounds heal completely in a day, two at the most. Why, because their water is kept pristine.
    I'm sure there must be a good use for salt in a freshwater aquarium, but in all my years of keeping fish I have not come across one.
    When I go fishing I just place a sharp rock in the water and sit there waiting for all the dead fish to float to the top... Kingfisher
    Brutal honesty will be shown on this screen.
    I think my fish is adjusting well to the four gallon, He's laying on his side attempting to go to sleep on the bottom of the gravel.
    Tolerance is a great thing to have, so is the ability to shut up.

    I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.


  8. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    So it seems, given the choice, at least those fishkeepers that have replied to my question, choose not to use salt for most any reason, especially as a medicine????

    Then what, for example, would you use to treat the tank, if you had to treat ALL THE TANK at once for ich??? Please keep in mind the fish I keep----neon tetras (sensitive fish) and Pangio kuhli loaches (scaleless and sensitive). Please give EXACT MANUFACTURER NAME and PRODUCT NAME when recommending. It is important to me to know what you have USED in YOUR EXPERIENCE to successfully treat ich in a community aquarium that contains scaleless fish.

    I love my loaches most, and would choose to get rid of all other fish and keep them instead if forced to choose between them. But kuhli/coolie loaches are the most difficult fish to care for when it comes to disease. And limited in my country with products.

    Fortunately, I do NOT need any medicine now. But I want to be prepared when need it.
    50 gal - finally fish! 11 pangio kuhli loaches, 10 neon tetras, 4 zebra danios, 3 cherry barbs, 3 guppies
    10 gal - temporarily closed
    5 gal - temporarily closed

    Proverbs 11:14 & 15:22 -- Thanks for your help!

  9. #9

    Join Date
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    Default


    0 Not allowed!

    When I go fishing I just place a sharp rock in the water and sit there waiting for all the dead fish to float to the top... Kingfisher
    Brutal honesty will be shown on this screen.
    I think my fish is adjusting well to the four gallon, He's laying on his side attempting to go to sleep on the bottom of the gravel.
    Tolerance is a great thing to have, so is the ability to shut up.

    I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.


  10. #10

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    This is why we are all individuals with different ideas and why it is difficult in this hobby to grab onto an idea and run with it.

    In my particular case, QuickCure cost me a whole lot of tetra's before it finally cured the Ick. I didn't care for it at all but I did have good luck with Ick Guard. (They also make Ick Guard for Sensitive Fish) which is probably nothing more than a weaker solution.

    Just as you have numerous people who prefer a particular Ick Medication, you will have different views on how to treat Ick with loaches in the tank.
    One person will warn against using medication of any kind with loaches and the next person will recommend it.

    Just as salt can be harsh to the skin of loaches, so can some of the medications. You decide what method you want to use and if it works for you, then great. If the fish are stressed during treatment, do a large water change and try something else.
    Last edited by Lady Hobbs; 05-05-2012 at 02:13 PM.

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