Sick Goldfish, need help quick...

[JohnnyOnTheSpot]

I'm not sure if this is in the right place, this is obviously my first post and I'm just trying to help my fish.

I got two goldfish for Christmas...my first ones, Gladys and Bernie. During feeding, Gladys started nipping at Bernie, so we'd move her temporarily to feed her. She kept attacking him so we kept her in a smaller area which was treated properly overnight, and upon waking she was bad. She was sitting at the bottom, seemingly gasping, like she's never done before. I moved her back into the main tank, and she's been pretty lifeless all day. She has gotten up to swim a few times, but pretty much has been lying in the gravel, gasping. Bernie's fine, and actually stays by her side 99% of the time.

I went to the pet store later today who told me to go to a specialty store, and after talking with the guy there, I decided to go with the salt and test the water. I tested the water, and while the ammonia was a little high, it couldn't be too bad in the main tank because Bernie's perfectly fine.

So anyway, I put the appropriate amount of salt in, and she got up and looked like her old self again! Then, out of nowhere, she went back to the bottom. She shot up once or twice and darted to the top going for bubbles, then right back down and hasn't moved in about 30 minutes.

I put a video on Youtube for diagnosis purposes. As I'm typing this, she just got up and is swimming around the top again, only to go back to the gravel. I don't know what to do, and I'm not taking this very well as I really like this fish. Any help would be greatly appreciated.



New thing, like 5 times in a row she swam to the top, varying in length, then crashed down to the bottom. Like, seriously went down without any bracing.

[Raedwulf]

We had a similar problem with a new tank we set up for our daughters.
Goldfish prefer a cooler tank than regular tropicals; we dropped the heater temp, practically turned off and the fish came up from the bottom... cool water goes down
See if that's the issue

[JohnnyOnTheSpot]

There's no heater in there. The water is room temperature. And the other fish is fine, so I doubt it's the temperature, but thanks for the response.

[JohnnyOnTheSpot]

I'm now wondering if it's a bladder problem, as some of the symptoms match up. She wouldn't eat a pea, even mashed and skinless. She showed no interest in it. I'm really worried about her.

[Honey Badger 1]

your tank is not properly cycled. your fish are suffering because there is ammonia in the tank. please read this sticky on how to properly cycle a tank with fish, http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aqua...ad.php?t=36492
do you have an airstone running in the tank. if not i suggest you get one. when was the last time you did a water change, unless it was in the last few hours i suggest another one right away. ammonia burns the gills and makes it difficult for the fish to breath, that's why your fish is gasping at the bottom and trying to get to the top for air.

[lotus flower]

I agree with what mommy1 said.

You mentioned letting the water sit overnight--you might consider adding a dechlorinator/dechloramine treatment to the water anyhow. Even small amounts of chemicals can have a huge impact on fish.

The ammonia is most likely the problem. It doesn't take much for the fish to become very ill, very quickly. The process of cycling your tank is so important because it reduces not only the ammonia, but also the other harmful chemicals fish waste produces (nitrites and nitrates).

You don't mention whether your tank has a filter on it, or what size your tank is. Please understand that goldfish produce much more waste than other fish and as such, it is very important to keep their water clean through at the very least frequently changing the water 25-50%. Filtering will also help clear the water, but goldfish really need a large amount of water (not a bowl but a tank) so that any harmful wastes are not only diluted but can be appropriately degraded by the bacteria in the gravel. The more surface area in the tank, the more beneficial bacteria can grow and the healthier the environment will be for your fish once your tank is cycled. Plus, the more surface area of water exposed to the air, the more oxygen that can diffuse across it and oxygenate the water for your fish.

For 2 goldfish, you will probably need at least a 10-gallon tank to keep them alive for any length of time. A bowl is really not adequate:
1. It does not hold enough water, so your fish don't have room to swim
2. It cannot hold enough dissolved oxygen for the fish to breathe
3. It will dirty very quickly and very easily (probably needing water changes daily)

Please consider adding filtration and/or aeration with an air stone and air pump. Particularly when fish are having difficulty breathing (gasping, lying at the bottom), it is important to make sure that they can get enough oxygen from their water. If the ammonia has damaged your fish's gills, you will need to give him/her the best chance at recovery by making sure oxygen availability is not an issue.

Please read up on the tank, oxygen, and cleaning requirements of goldfish. You will find that they are wonderful fish to have and can live a long, happy, healthy life in your aquarium if they have their needs met by their environment.

Let us know how she does! Best of luck!

[JohnnyOnTheSpot]

Gladys just died. I haven't felt this terrible in a while.

I need to explain how this came about. My mom got Gladys back in August for her birthday, and the person who gave it to her gave her a bowl as well. The lady claimed to know fish really well. My mom brought Gladys home from work for thanksgiving, and I became really attached. I started reading up on fish, and found out quickly the bowl was inhumane. Gladys was still really tiny, so a few days before Christmas we upgraded to a 5 gallon tank. I knew at the time it was too small, but she was small, and it was only temporary.

My mom decided to surprise with me with a black moor, Bernie. I didn't want another fish because I knew the 5 gallon was too small, but he kind of fell into my lap and I didn't have much recourse. I have limited space and money as of now, and both fish really fell into my life. I wouldn't have gotten them on my own because I know I didn't have adequate quarters for them.

The tank has a filter, I treat the water and do a 20% cycle every 5-7 days. Gladys and Bernie were inseparable, but Gladys was attacking Bernie during feeding, so we moved her to a bowl just for feeding. Bernie was finally getting enough food and sprang to life. Gladys seemed to get grumpier, but she only attacked during feeding. My mom commented that she wasn't pooping, but she was otherwise fine so I didn't think much of it.

I'm not some dumb kid who just wanted fish because they were cute. I'm 23 and in law school, and have spent my entire 3 weeks off researching this stuff and trying to take care of these fish. I really care about animals, always have since I was little. I'm from Philly and hate the Eagles now because of Vick being there...I'm a real big softie with them. A bigger tank is in the near future, rest assured. I'm doing my best with what I currently have and the situation that was kind of forced on me.

With that said, I think Gladys got an infected bladder. She looked alright up until yesterday, when she started staying near the bottom. But she could get up and swim whenever she wanted. An hour before death she just laid at the bottom, tilting over. She got up for one last hoorah, swam upside-down, then died on her side. It was terrible to watch, and I felt absolutely abysmal. I have no idea how this happened, with my only inclination being from her stealing Bernie's food initially. I tried to feed her a pea, and she ignored it. I mashed it up and everything.

I've never had a fish until now, and honestly never wanted one. I loved both of these fish to death and was trying really hard with what I had, and I just want to make sure Bernie's going to make it. As of now he looks as lively as ever.

In response to mommy1, as I mentioned in this post I was cycling the water and running the filter at all times. I also don't think it was a problem with the tank because Bernie was completely fine, no gasping or anything.

[Honey Badger 1]

cycling a tank is not changing water. cycling a tank is growing beneficial bacteria in a filter and on the hard surfaces inside the tank. these bacteria convert harmful ammonia to nitrite then to nitrate which we remove to keep under safe levels with water changes. here is a link to some information about the bacteria i am talking about. http://www.bioconlabs.com/nitribactfacts.html
please read the other link i posted so you can properly cycle the tank for the remaining fish.
i'm sorry for your loss.

[lotus flower]

I'm sorry to hear about Gladys. We've all been there, and it's never easy.

I'm in school as well (I'm 24), and money is very tight for me. I can usually find some quality equipment at local thrift stores or the Goodwill. I recommend going there or looking on Craigslist to see what people are unloading (usually people sell cheaply before a move). You don't have to worry about using secondhand equipment--just rinse it out with some distilled white vinegar and water, then rinse it very thoroughly to remove the vinegar. It'll look good as new.

For the time being, try changing your water at least every 2-3 days, and I would bump it up to 25-30% each time. You might also consider adding something like Tetra's Nitraban or any of the ammonia-reducing chemicals that are on the market with each water change. This may help keep the ammonia within safe levels until your tank is cycled.

Don't clean your filters frequently--this will help speed up the cycling process, as the bacteria are growing there. Once a month will be just fine, and even then only rinse the gunk out of your filter media using dechlorinated water from your tank (tap water has chlorine in it that will kill the good bacteria).

You may want to add a live plant or two to help absorb some of the fish's waste and produce oxygen in your tank. Heavily planted tanks sometimes undergo a "silent cycle", where the ammonia doesn't end up spiking but instead is absorbed by the plants and doesn't harm the fish.

[JohnnyOnTheSpot]

Thanks for the help so far. I went out this morning to the fish store and talked to the people there. I picked up some Nutrafin Cycle per there advice and treated the water after changing 20% of the water. The Ammonia level seems to be around 2, which I know isn't good, so tomorrow I plan to change 40% and treat the water again with the Nutrafin Cycle. I also picked up some Pro-Ammonia detox but I'm scared to add it right now because I'm not sure if I can mix the products.

Bernie's looking great, aside from the fact that he looks lonely and is chasing his reflection in the side of the glass. The tank's looking good; I haven't changed the filter yet and stopped vacuuming the gravel at all (I was doing a little with each change). I cut down on his feeding a bit just to balance out the water levels. Should I add more salt? Anything?

I also have a question. I have a spare bowl and was wondering if it would be better to move him into it for a bit to speed up the process, or at least kill the ammonia level. I know it's not ideal but I don't know which evil is lesser at this point. I'd be willing to change the bowl water twice a day if it meant helping Bernie. I didn't know this was possible but he's such a sweet fish, and I just want to make sure he's going to be ok and happy.

I appreciate all of the help so far, and right now Bernie's health means the world to me, so I'm open to anything.