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Results 1 to 10 of 13
  1. Default Yo yo loaches sitting still from time to time


    0 Not allowed!
    So I added two more yo yo loaches and the one loachthat was lonely and skinny seems a lot more lively now and looks like he gained some weight. From time to time, I'll see one or two of the loaches out of the 5 lying almost lifeless on my heater's suction cups or on one of the ornament pieces. It almost looks like they are dead, but when I click on the glass near them they start moving again. Is this behavior normal? They find a spot and just lay there lifeless and I've seen it quite a few times. I do weekly water changes and just did one Saturday about 35% of the water instead of the usual 25%. All the other fish in there seem to be doing well. I use Seachem Prime for the water conditioner.

    I feed them a wide variety of food usually two times a day. Flakes, zucchini, frozen bloodworms, freeze dried bloodworms, peas, shrimp pellets, algae wafers
    Here are my specs:
    55 gallon aquarium
    Two filters (One Aqueon Power Filter rated for 30-45 gallon tanks and One Top Fin Filter for 25 gallon tanks)
    One heater running at 80-82 degrees
    Do 25% water changes, just did 35% yesterday

    Two guppy fry a few weeks old
    2 Adult guppy
    2 Mickey Mouse Platy
    2 Silver Platy
    1 Rubberlip Pleco
    5 Ghost Shrimp

  2. #2

    Default


    1 Not allowed!
    Resting is normal loach behaviour. Though I would suggest a couple of changes from the info you have provided.

    First is temperature. Assuming this is not due to seasonal weather but the heater setting, I would lower it to around 77F. Although a riverine fish, this species (Botia almorhae) inhabits calm water pools of highland streams in India, Nepal and Bangladesh, possibly Pakistan though this is doubtful [I'll explain this below]. Highland streams are generally cooler than lowland rivers.

    Second is feeding, I would recommend once a day and then miss a day or two each week (water change day is one that can be missed). Restrict frozen bloodworms to once or at most twice a week. The beggies are good, but "meat" is essential as these are primarily carnivorous. The small snails will eager be eaten most times.

    Water changes are important for this species as it does not tolerate poor water quality or nitrates. Not that yours are bad, but a 50% water change weekly would be better.

    Now on the Pakistan item, in case you/others are interested; I always like knowing these things about my fish.

    The exact species name of this fish is still uncertain. Originally it was deemed to be Botia lohachata, the name assigned by B.L. Chaudhuri in 1912, and it is still widely seen under this name. Botia is derived from an Asian word for soldier or warrior. In the early 1990's it was suggested that this species epithet was a synonym for Botia almorhae, the true species, which had been described in 1831 by J.E. Gray. Dr. Maurice Kottelat (2004), an acknowledged authority on this family, assigned the name B. lohachata as a synonym of B. almorhae and not a distinct species in his major revision of the genus which he separated into seven genera.

    Steven Grant (2007) has proposed that B. almorhae may in fact consist of five distinct but closely-related species:
    Botia almorhae Gray, 1831
    Botia birdi Chaudhuri, 1909
    Botia lohachata Chaudhuri 1912
    Botia sp. "Kosi", possibly a variant of B. almorhae
    Botia sp. "Teesta", possibly a variant of B. almorhae

    The striking similarity in pattern among these fish certainly makes this feasible; Dr. Bill Eschmeyer at the California Academy of Sciences--Ichthyology has accepted the validity of the first three distinct species. The authors of Loaches Online accept B. almorhae as the species of the subject fish. The occurrence in Pakistan is restricted to the species B. birdi described by Chaudhuri in 1909.

    [Finally, the Pakistan connection.]

    Byron.

  3. Default


    1 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Byron View Post
    Resting is normal loach behaviour. Though I would suggest a couple of changes from the info you have provided.

    First is temperature. Assuming this is not due to seasonal weather but the heater setting, I would lower it to around 77F. Although a riverine fish, this species (Botia almorhae) inhabits calm water pools of highland streams in India, Nepal and Bangladesh, possibly Pakistan though this is doubtful [I'll explain this below]. Highland streams are generally cooler than lowland rivers.

    Second is feeding, I would recommend once a day and then miss a day or two each week (water change day is one that can be missed). Restrict frozen bloodworms to once or at most twice a week. The beggies are good, but "meat" is essential as these are primarily carnivorous. The small snails will eager be eaten most times.

    Water changes are important for this species as it does not tolerate poor water quality or nitrates. Not that yours are bad, but a 50% water change weekly would be better.

    Now on the Pakistan item, in case you/others are interested; I always like knowing these things about my fish.

    The exact species name of this fish is still uncertain. Originally it was deemed to be Botia lohachata, the name assigned by B.L. Chaudhuri in 1912, and it is still widely seen under this name. Botia is derived from an Asian word for soldier or warrior. In the early 1990's it was suggested that this species epithet was a synonym for Botia almorhae, the true species, which had been described in 1831 by J.E. Gray. Dr. Maurice Kottelat (2004), an acknowledged authority on this family, assigned the name B. lohachata as a synonym of B. almorhae and not a distinct species in his major revision of the genus which he separated into seven genera.

    Steven Grant (2007) has proposed that B. almorhae may in fact consist of five distinct but closely-related species:
    Botia almorhae Gray, 1831
    Botia birdi Chaudhuri, 1909
    Botia lohachata Chaudhuri 1912
    Botia sp. "Kosi", possibly a variant of B. almorhae
    Botia sp. "Teesta", possibly a variant of B. almorhae

    The striking similarity in pattern among these fish certainly makes this feasible; Dr. Bill Eschmeyer at the California Academy of Sciences--Ichthyology has accepted the validity of the first three distinct species. The authors of Loaches Online accept B. almorhae as the species of the subject fish. The occurrence in Pakistan is restricted to the species B. birdi described by Chaudhuri in 1909.

    [Finally, the Pakistan connection.]

    Byron.
    Byron,

    As always thank you very much for your informative posts. I'm going to go ahead and turn down the temperature to 76-78 tonight. I live in FL so temperature is usually warm here and gets very humid. I do have AC on most of the time. Also, since I've fed them two times today already I'll get their fasting session going with not feeding them until tomorrow night.

  4. #4

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    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    You'll want to be a bit more careful of having fry in the tank with your loaches as they get bigger, if you aim to keep them. I've seen them eat lots of fry in my own tank. I've also transferred snails to the tank for them to eat. Meat eaters indeed.

  5. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    I just wanted to post an update. All the other loaches seem to be thriving, but this one fish the skinniest one, even from the beginning appears sick and just does not thrive at all. He just finds a spot to lay down on and looks completely dead. I did a 50% water change about 2 days ago and all the other fish are thriving as usual but this one loach found a new spot now and he lays down with his belly up. I'm not sure what to do at this point. Please see video link below to see what I'm referring to. (Also, I know the decoration is horrible and that's one area I'm still working on slowly but surely).




  6. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Another final update - Looking at it a few times this morning, it seems to be doing OK. I do see it doing these seizure type movements sometimes and I know I've seen it with some of the other loaches in the past. Also, shemauri - You are right about the fry but I think having it in a breeder tank within the same tank as the loaches made them adjust to it. I waited about a month and half before I released them to see how they do and so far about a month later, they are doing fine. What's interesting is that one of the fry is doing better than the other in terms of growth. By that I mean I see coloring on the tail and skin, where as the other fry is finally starting to show changes about a week and half later. I wonder why that is...

  7. #7

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    On that skinny loach. I know how discouraging it is when this happens with a single fish, but it does. There may be a genetic issue with the fish, or it may have been injured internally during capture. There is no cure for either, and in the absence of external issues that might affect other fish, I would just leave it alone and let nature takes its course.

    Byron.

  8. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Byron View Post
    On that skinny loach. I know how discouraging it is when this happens with a single fish, but it does. There may be a genetic issue with the fish, or it may have been injured internally during capture. There is no cure for either, and in the absence of external issues that might affect other fish, I would just leave it alone and let nature takes its course.

    Byron.
    I saw some of the loaches doing the seizure attack movements, so I went ahead and did a 45% water change last Saturday. A few days later, they seem to be doing better but today I am seeing 2 or 3 of them either hiding or resting on the suction cups. The newest loach which I got about a week ago which was doing fine initially is also resting and is gray in color. So a total of 6 loaches I have just FYI.

    I tested the water and here are what my levels are:

    8.2 PH
    0 Ammonia
    0 Nitrate
    20-30ish Nitrate

    Are my levels OK? Not sure what is causing them to just rest in that one position all day. I haven't honestly changed anything and have been following the fasting routine but not as often.
    I'm posting pictures of the levels in case anyone interprets them differently. IMG_20131029_161245.jpgIMG_20131029_161236.jpgIMG_20131029_161245.jpg

  9. #9

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    The nitrate is something to correct; from the photo I would be inclined to think it is at minimum 40ppm and perhaps higher. Has the nitrate been this high previously, or is this new? Have you tested the tap water on its own for nitrate (also ammonia and nitrite)? This needs to be addressed as 20ppm is the max but even this is high. Are there live plants (and if so, which)? Water changes I assume are normally regular; have you been vacuuming the substrate well at each WC? Is the tank heavily stocked?

    The pH is high for this species, but as long as this is stable I wouldn't expect this to be the sole cause. Any idea of the GH?

    Byron.

  10. Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Byron View Post
    The nitrate is something to correct; from the photo I would be inclined to think it is at minimum 40ppm and perhaps higher. Has the nitrate been this high previously, or is this new? Have you tested the tap water on its own for nitrate (also ammonia and nitrite)? This needs to be addressed as 20ppm is the max but even this is high. Are there live plants (and if so, which)? Water changes I assume are normally regular; have you been vacuuming the substrate well at each WC? Is the tank heavily stocked?

    The pH is high for this species, but as long as this is stable I wouldn't expect this to be the sole cause. Any idea of the GH?

    Byron.
    I don't remember nitrate ever being this high since starting my hobby of fish keeping about 6-7 months ago. Have not tested tap water on its own. The only live plant is Hornwort plant and its growth is rather slow compared to what I've seen in my LFS. Yes, I do water changes at least once a week and have been pretty straight forward with this routine as of the past 2 months. Yes, I vacuum substrate during the WC process. Go in and out thoroughly every area I can and get out as much stuff as possible. I guess you could say it is heavily stocked....here is what I have:

    2 Adult guppy
    2 Mickey Mouse Platy
    2 Silver Platy
    1 Rubberlip Pleco
    5 Ghost Shrimp
    6 yo yo loaches

    I put in a new filter replacing the top fin filter as of 2 weeks ago called the Eheim 2217. It's a canister filter and does a good job in creating a flow and bubbles inside the water, apart from the filtering.
    The other filter is the aqueon filter rated for 30 gallon. I kept that on to keep the bacteria thriving since the eheim needed to adjust and have time for bacteria to establish there.

    Update: As of this morning 8am EDT till now 12:10 PM...I am seeing all of the fish thriving and haven't seen any of the loaches rest anywhere as I've been constantly monitoring it in and out all day. The colors are back to normal and they seem healthy as ever. Not sure what is going on!

    Also, I have a fairly small malaysian wood for the pleco on the left side which I barely ever see it eat. I have cypress wood that I would like to put inside now that I bought a coral type rock that I will also be putting in. I have to do some research on these but I'm guessing adding both of these might increase my PH?

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