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  1. #1

    Join Date
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    It's EOTW Beer Time! - KevinVA Nobody likes to drinl alone :) - steeler58 Back at you,  good sir! - Compass Here's to Lee's 5000 and Guava Flavored Whiskey! - Taurus Why drink alone, when a Sandz is nearby? - KevinVA 
    Sorry to hear of your loss, it always sucks to lose fish. - mommy1 Wish it was a real one, sorry for your loses :( - steeler58 So sorry about your fish! - SeaLady Here is pie. - mommy1 for the one you lost :o( - fishmommie 
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    Default Need some help from you plumbing experts on here:


    0 Not allowed!
    Ok so this weekend I will be getting my electric done in my garage to add the breakers to support my fish racks. Its going to take me a while to get the rack finalized but in doing the rack, the plumbing comes right after. For the rack, I plan on a simple stem pipe topped with a sponge to prevent fish transfers, each stem pipe will flow down to the next row in the rack and the tank below it on a simple waterfall system with a pvc elbow extending down into the top level of the tank to eliminate constant water sounds. The bottom row for the rack will be the combined input to the central sump pump/refugium. This will be a 55gal tank with baffles seperating the section.

    Ok so now you know my plan to set that up, here is where I need help:

    Obviously it would take a lot of time doing water changes on these tanks. How can I efficiently plumb a water change system into this? Prefferable it be automated.

    Need to know info:
    This is in a garage.
    There will be a utility sink but that will be located on the other side of the 20ft+ wide garage.
    The water heater is on the same wall but opposite side of the garage.
    The source can be t'd off for filling but how do I eliminate chlorine and chloromines?
    FW: 1 45gal, 1 40gal, 3 10gal, 3 30gal all community tanks of different species
    Sw: 1 55gal, 1 30gal show, 1 29gal show, 1 20gal and 2 10's

  2. #2

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandz View Post
    a pvc elbow extending down into the top level of the tank to eliminate constant water sounds I think you will still hear water unless the tube will always be filled... not sure though

    Ok so now you know my plan to set that up, here is where I need help:

    Obviously it would take a lot of time doing water changes on these tanks. How can I efficiently plumb a water change system into this? Prefferable it be automated. What I plan to do for this on my rack would be to drill a hole in bottom 3rd of the sump, bulkhead and run a pvc line out with a ball valve - to drain the whole system open ball valve and make sure pump is off. Then just refill the sump with a hose, or a permanent water line ran to it. It's not automated, but it would be very easy, turn off pump, open valve - go drink beer - close valve, fill sump, use syringe to dose prime turn on pump

    Need to know info:
    This is in a garage.
    There will be a utility sink but that will be located on the other side of the 20ft+ wide garage.
    The water heater is on the same wall but opposite side of the garage.
    The source can be t'd off for filling but how do I eliminate chlorine and chloromines?
    See red info

  3. #3

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Plus, the bigger the lines you run (for fill and drain) you could make this process pretty quick. I plan to have it drain to a sump, but being in a garage you can just have it drain down the driveway, or through the wall into the yard.

    Run 2 3/4" pvc lines with valves (1hot 1cold), have them T together before the sump, and have one more valve. Set the temp with the two on the individual lines, and then leave those as is and just use the combined line valve. You can have these tied in at the sink on the other side of the room and ran around the room on the floor (or wall)

    Just some pvc, but costs should be low, and will make life pretty easy if I say so

  4. #4

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    With a single straight gravity feed drain pipe, you might get a fare amount of noise. I also would not put a sponge in the intake of a gravity feed drain line as that might end up restricting the air flow too much. Instead I would suggest a single duriso stand pipe in each tank with a screen or pc of egg crate across the opening

    However, this all depending the number and size of tanks in the set-up, the height of the lowest tank in relation to the height of the top of your sump, if the tanks are going to be drilled on the bottom or back, and what type of flow you whant going through each tank.

    If you could share a little more info, I would be gald to offer some more detailed suggestions.
    If you take your time to do the research FIRST, you can successfully set-up and keep ANY type of aquarium with ease.
    "Not using a quarantine tank is like playing Russian roulette. Nobody wins the game, some people just get to play longer than others." - Anthony Calfo
    Fishless Cycle Cycling with Fish Marine Aquarium Info [URL="http://saltwater.aquaticcommunity.com/"]

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
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    Awards Showcase

    It's EOTW Beer Time! - KevinVA Nobody likes to drinl alone :) - steeler58 Back at you,  good sir! - Compass Here's to Lee's 5000 and Guava Flavored Whiskey! - Taurus Why drink alone, when a Sandz is nearby? - KevinVA 
    Sorry to hear of your loss, it always sucks to lose fish. - mommy1 Wish it was a real one, sorry for your loses :( - steeler58 So sorry about your fish! - SeaLady Here is pie. - mommy1 for the one you lost :o( - fishmommie 
    No Message - Fishhook Bottoms up! - Slaphppy7 Thanks, this one is on me - mommy1 Here's to 4,000 posts :) - steeler58 T.G.I.F.! - Slaphppy7 
    TGIF and here's to good whiskey :-) - Taurus Thanks for the rep :) - rebecca_finny pizza for all.  I finished my book today!!! - fishmommie thank you for your help and advice - showmebutterfly Even Monday's are better with severum - showmebutterfly 

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cliff View Post
    With a single straight gravity feed drain pipe, you might get a fare amount of noise. I also would not put a sponge in the intake of a gravity feed drain line as that might end up restricting the air flow too much. Instead I would suggest a single duriso stand pipe in each tank with a screen or pc of egg crate across the opening

    I have tool left over from my wedding that is of use. I can use this with no issue to block the stem pipe. The plan to make it silent would be for the stem to extend from the bottom of the tank down and elbow into the next tank. The elbow would be half submerged so the only falling would be in the stem. I have experomented with this and its far less noisy than other ways.

    However, this all depending the number and size of tanks in the set-up, the height of the lowest tank in relation to the height of the top of your sump, if the tanks are going to be drilled on the bottom or back, and what type of flow you whant going through each tank.

    20 tanks, 5 each shelf, 4 shelfs high, each tank is 20long, Flow = 5x turnover or more/hr and that would be indicitave of the pump I would buy. THinking of a mag9. The tanks are bottom drilled, not back drilled unfortunately.
    I am trying to duplicate a lot of what hans did here:
    http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showth...hans+fish+rack

    What was done is a backdrill pvc elbow and he put a ball valve on each tank where I think I just need one for the top rack to spread even refill flow. I am never going to stop a drain from draining on an individual tank.

    If you could share a little more info, I would be gald to offer some more detailed suggestions.
    Now with this in mind, my thought for a simple drain was to T the drain to the sump to a wet line out to the yard like Hardy had mentioned. My biggest issues with this is that I have to add water to make sure my pump doesnt run dry and then how am I certain that the drain is taking out only old water?
    FW: 1 45gal, 1 40gal, 3 10gal, 3 30gal all community tanks of different species
    Sw: 1 55gal, 1 30gal show, 1 29gal show, 1 20gal and 2 10's

  6. #6

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    I would suggest looking into getting a bigger sump, one that will not only accept all the drainback form the tanks, but also hold enough water for you to be able to achieve the size of water change that you want without have to worry about draining the tanks. Maybe look into using some type of rubber maid container or something along those lines if this could be a option for your

    A mag drive 9 (if I am remember correctly) only has around 1200 gph of flow. That will not be even close to what you are going to need to get around 100 gph in each tank on the top rack once you factor in the loss of flow from the height as well as all of the elbows and the flow taken by the lower tanks. 20 tanks each needing 100 gph will mean you will need a pump that can supply 2,000 gph of flow after factoring in the loss of flow from the height of the tanks and any other flow restriction such as elbows. You would need a pump with between 2,500 to 3,500 gph depending in the pumping design and exact height of the top row. A external pump would likely fit your needs a little better, like a Reeflo hybrid. This would also give you more room in your sump as well. Might be a better option to look into
    If you take your time to do the research FIRST, you can successfully set-up and keep ANY type of aquarium with ease.
    "Not using a quarantine tank is like playing Russian roulette. Nobody wins the game, some people just get to play longer than others." - Anthony Calfo
    Fishless Cycle Cycling with Fish Marine Aquarium Info [URL="http://saltwater.aquaticcommunity.com/"]

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    4,391

    Awards Showcase

    It's EOTW Beer Time! - KevinVA Nobody likes to drinl alone :) - steeler58 Back at you,  good sir! - Compass Here's to Lee's 5000 and Guava Flavored Whiskey! - Taurus Why drink alone, when a Sandz is nearby? - KevinVA 
    Sorry to hear of your loss, it always sucks to lose fish. - mommy1 Wish it was a real one, sorry for your loses :( - steeler58 So sorry about your fish! - SeaLady Here is pie. - mommy1 for the one you lost :o( - fishmommie 
    No Message - Fishhook Bottoms up! - Slaphppy7 Thanks, this one is on me - mommy1 Here's to 4,000 posts :) - steeler58 T.G.I.F.! - Slaphppy7 
    TGIF and here's to good whiskey :-) - Taurus Thanks for the rep :) - rebecca_finny pizza for all.  I finished my book today!!! - fishmommie thank you for your help and advice - showmebutterfly Even Monday's are better with severum - showmebutterfly 

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Hmm that is food for thought. I havnt looked hard at any pumps yet so mag9 was the closest I was thinking on. Also the size of the sump is hard to change. I could easily do a trashcan version of a canister filter but that was space and overkill without the refugium. How much drainback could I expect in gallons from a 8ft, 1in pvc + the small ammount left to drain from the bottom shelf? Wouldnt the baffle hight determine this? I thought the 55gal would cover it fine. I can absolutely buy a 6ft rubbermaid bin but space and all that has me changing plans.

    Im looking up the hybrid reeflo now.
    FW: 1 45gal, 1 40gal, 3 10gal, 3 30gal all community tanks of different species
    Sw: 1 55gal, 1 30gal show, 1 29gal show, 1 20gal and 2 10's

  8. #8

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    My thought would be to shut off the pump during the water changes. The tanks will all drain down to the lowest level you can achieve (just like a power outage) and have it draining into the yard, don't turn the pump back on until you refill the sump, and fill the water. After a few tests you should be able to mark the sump with fill lines so you know where to go up too.

    I also think you are going to want a bigger sump

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
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    Awards Showcase

    It's EOTW Beer Time! - KevinVA Nobody likes to drinl alone :) - steeler58 Back at you,  good sir! - Compass Here's to Lee's 5000 and Guava Flavored Whiskey! - Taurus Why drink alone, when a Sandz is nearby? - KevinVA 
    Sorry to hear of your loss, it always sucks to lose fish. - mommy1 Wish it was a real one, sorry for your loses :( - steeler58 So sorry about your fish! - SeaLady Here is pie. - mommy1 for the one you lost :o( - fishmommie 
    No Message - Fishhook Bottoms up! - Slaphppy7 Thanks, this one is on me - mommy1 Here's to 4,000 posts :) - steeler58 T.G.I.F.! - Slaphppy7 
    TGIF and here's to good whiskey :-) - Taurus Thanks for the rep :) - rebecca_finny pizza for all.  I finished my book today!!! - fishmommie thank you for your help and advice - showmebutterfly Even Monday's are better with severum - showmebutterfly 

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Cliff - what do you think of this: http://www.salesavo.com/avo.php/Sale...ck_by_Sunterra

    Given calculations you stated, 4x per hour is enough for fry and the breeding stock in the tanks with the given amount of water changes. 20*20= 400gal, 400galx5 = 2k, 2k - the elbows and loss flow would avg closer to 1600-1750 which is plenty for the set up.
    FW: 1 45gal, 1 40gal, 3 10gal, 3 30gal all community tanks of different species
    Sw: 1 55gal, 1 30gal show, 1 29gal show, 1 20gal and 2 10's

  10. #10

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    4,391

    Awards Showcase

    It's EOTW Beer Time! - KevinVA Nobody likes to drinl alone :) - steeler58 Back at you,  good sir! - Compass Here's to Lee's 5000 and Guava Flavored Whiskey! - Taurus Why drink alone, when a Sandz is nearby? - KevinVA 
    Sorry to hear of your loss, it always sucks to lose fish. - mommy1 Wish it was a real one, sorry for your loses :( - steeler58 So sorry about your fish! - SeaLady Here is pie. - mommy1 for the one you lost :o( - fishmommie 
    No Message - Fishhook Bottoms up! - Slaphppy7 Thanks, this one is on me - mommy1 Here's to 4,000 posts :) - steeler58 T.G.I.F.! - Slaphppy7 
    TGIF and here's to good whiskey :-) - Taurus Thanks for the rep :) - rebecca_finny pizza for all.  I finished my book today!!! - fishmommie thank you for your help and advice - showmebutterfly Even Monday's are better with severum - showmebutterfly 

    Default


    0 Not allowed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hardy85 View Post
    My thought would be to shut off the pump during the water changes. The tanks will all drain down to the lowest level you can achieve (just like a power outage) and have it draining into the yard, don't turn the pump back on until you refill the sump, and fill the water. After a few tests you should be able to mark the sump with fill lines so you know where to go up too.

    I also think you are going to want a bigger sump
    If I had the larger sump this would be a simple option. I have the space to get a 6ft rubbermaid bin and place it directly under the drain line. I had plans to do this for the 55gal but would easily upgrade this to a rubbermaide bin. I dont know how to do baffles or external support for such a project though... My issue then would be that I dont want to change such little amounts of water. I like to do at least 50% w/c so this would mean a cumulative system of 200 gallons of water. In the start this will be easy, being that not all tanks will have stock. Full, it pressents a diversion.
    FW: 1 45gal, 1 40gal, 3 10gal, 3 30gal all community tanks of different species
    Sw: 1 55gal, 1 30gal show, 1 29gal show, 1 20gal and 2 10's

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