Mass fish death

**ddavis1979** · 02-12-2013, 03:04 PM

My biggest issue with the drip method is water temperature. Especially this time of year, the air temp is typically cooler, and if i dont have a heater in the acclimation process, then the water temp drops pretty quickly. I had to weigh the risks, is a potential pH difference more of a shock than a known temperature difference? I honestly don't know the answer to that questions, but people hae floated bags for decades. At the same time, adding LFS water to your tank is very risky. I tend to be someone one that says "F*** it" and takes my chances and most of the time things work out fine.....but some of the time I get burned.

**imma24** · 02-12-2013, 03:20 PM

What I usually do that many people do is open the bag and slowly add a little tank water a little at a time - maybe a 1/4 cup - wait a few minutes, then add more. Eventually, I let out about half the water in the bag into a sink and then resume adding small amounts of tank water for a total of about 5-10min, waiting a minute or 2 in between. I then net the fish into my tank.

**KevinVA** · 02-12-2013, 03:20 PM

I had been doing that, too, until the addition of rocks had raised my pH to 7.6 (and since I know it's from the rocks, I know there's a change in gH/kH (which can cause osmotic shock to fish). Now it's a .6 difference between the tap and my water (and I know the LFS has a pH of 7). I feel a lot more safe with the drip.

However, if you know your params don't differ much from your LFS, I'd be all for the "f*** it" method. I don't have a lot of patience, which is why QTs are not my forte.

**mizzoutank** · 02-12-2013, 06:03 PM

I agree with 850R, great points.

however, i'll play devils advocate again.

if i'm setting up the QT the first time, and putting in that batch of fish, then i'll go ahead and dump in the LFS water.
I ONLY do this on the basis, of whatever is in that water, the fish is already exposed too, and in my initial treatments of the QT, will likely remove that.
But at the same time, after a few hours of the fish getting settled, I do a 50% water change, and that should dilute/help if there were any potential issues with the LFS water.

however, if i have a fish in QT already, and plan to add a new one.
I won't add any LFS water and do what 850R's process is.

I think your best troubleshooting plan needs to be QT.
if this were to happen in a QT, your list of issues is drastically cut down/narrower to chose between.

**Goes to 11!** · 02-12-2013, 07:20 PM

Originally Posted by ddavis1979

people hae floated bags for decades. At the same time, adding LFS water to your tank is very risky. I tend to be someone one that says "F*** it" and takes my chances and most of the time things work out fine.....but some of the time I get burned.

Mizzou laid it out well in his QT example: The difference is what you risk..

You are either risking A bucket of fish OR a tank of fish, I make the same choice every time because we occasionally see how it turns out when it goes bad.

& you never know when it will go bad.

**ddavis1979** · 02-12-2013, 07:58 PM

Thats a pretty good point! See, thats why I come here, to gain a better perspective.

**ddavis1979** · 02-14-2013, 03:04 AM

Well...I am very "under stocked" at the moment. I rehomed the tiger barbs, I re-installed the bubbler, and I added a dose of melafix to the tank, and I continue to lose fish.

There is no trama to the body, no discoloration, the fish totally look normal. Maybe 4-6 hours before death, the fish looks to be gasping and swimming funny. But its not like I lose a bunch of fish at once. I would say 1-2 fish every 24-48 hours.

What can you think of that would cause a pattern of death like that? Its pregnant fish, its male fish, its neon tetras, black neon tetras, and cherry barbs. Nothing else has been effected yet. I have noticed a significant drop in the carbonate hardness of the water, but thats the only parameter than has changed, and everything else looks healthy.

**KevinVA** · 02-14-2013, 04:35 AM

I've experienced something like that when I first started up my 75gal (while it was heavily planted). I was using a canister filter w/out a spray bar, plus a koralia pump for circulation. I kept losing 1-2 fish every other day. I talked to someone at Petsmart of all places, who mentioned the possibility of the fish asphyxiating due to lack of oxygen, because of the released co2 at night from all of my plants. I added two bubblers and the problem went away.

People have already mentioned this possibility before... but who knows. Some people always shrug that off as a possibility, but if you ask me, it's clearly plausible. I see you re-installed the bubbler. When was that? How heavily planted is your tank?

**mizzoutank** · 02-14-2013, 05:14 AM

Kevin,

So plants take in CO2, and release O2.
hence why people add co2 systems for their plants to grow.
and turn them off at night because the light is not driving the photosynthesis process that allows plants to use the co2. leaving the co2 on over night=Overdose on it and it'll kill your fish.

He's running 2 hobs, there can't be a lack of o2 when you have that set up. the surface agitation created by hobs is plenty to full fill the tank needs.

**KevinVA** · 02-14-2013, 05:32 AM

CO2 is not absorbed, but released during the night. That is the problem. In essence, if you don't have enough free oxygen in your water, you could very well overdose your tank with CO2, if it's heavily planted w/out surface agitation. There can be a lack of O2 w/ hobs, if his tank is filled to the brink or plants are covering the outtake. Why do you think some people lower their water level in their tank, when they administer some medicines? More surface agitation to compensate for the medication's abilities to deplete oxygen in the tank.

I'm not saying this is his problem, because I don't even think that his tank is that heavily planted, I'm just suggesting that it's a possibility.