Help Again

[Goes to 11!]

Ok - If you remember reading about cycling with fish [If you made it that far into the pile of reading lol]... revisit it because you are now cycling with fish.

Well. I am not sure what to think about where you sit because you have no trAtes showing in the 30g but you have them in the 20.

Refresh my memory please, The 30 is newly set up right? newer than the 20 anyway?
Ammonia on the 30 is ?

yes, very soft water. Did you see the ammonia from the sticks I found? Are they at all accurate? AGES since I used a dipstick and you know my opinion - No idea really. Sorry. Technically they are better than nothing .... I guess.

OK here are the newest pictures.

Yes, I have 4 angels in the 20 gallon. How long can I keep them like that? I will stay on top of water changes.

I understand and appreciate your dedication but it's not about the WC, It's about the territory as said in the other thread.

I have no idea what to do with them all. My LFS is open Tuesday. Thinking of asking her to take the gold fish back and maybe the plecko, I read that a 30 may be to small for a plecko.

The 30 gallon has goldfish, dwarf gourami, 5 neon tetras, bw tetra and plecko currently. Betta is by himself

Can I maintain these until I can get myself a larger tank?

Depends on the pleco, If it's a common, Yeah, DEF goes.

There is no time frame I could say that I am comfortable with. The fish being mostly really small gives you a bit of breathing room but this will not do for too long. If you maintain the water you could get a month out of it maybe more but honestly there is no telling when an angel will decide to stake a claim, It is a ticking bomb as mommy mentioned last night.

[Kim S.]

yes the 20 has been up over a year and has ha no deaths or issues in a long time...

angels in there is temporary;noy going to keep them in there. just long enough to figure out a better plan.

how should i proceed? you have led me well thus far... just keep doing water changes; how much do i feed????

i have many more questions buy still reading...

[Kim S.]

Does the lights being on affect all this? I turned the heater up to 80, will that be ok forall my fish?? Im getting a headache just processing all this. My filter in the 20 has not been changed in a while, I am learning that this is a good thing... Do I need to add some water to the 30 from the 20 since it has the nitrites. I need a plan... How much water do I take out? Does this stress the fish??

[Goes to 11!]

Does the lights being on affect all this? I turned the heater up to 80, will that be ok forall my fish?? Im getting a headache just processing all this. My filter in the 20 has not been changed in a while, I am learning that this is a good thing... Do I need to add some water to the 30 from the 20 since it has the nitrites. I need a plan... How much water do I take out? Does this stress the fish??

In order:

I hope you don't mean the lights are on 24/7. Fish need some down time too, It's as natural to them as day and night.

80 is tolerable but higher than angels require, My angels live at 77/76f.

Right you are about the filter. Forgive me but I have forgotten what filters you have... The ones that take cartridges right? [Do nothing to the 30g at this time] You can LIGHTLY rinse the 20 cartridge in dechlorinated water or old tank water if it is especially funky IE: If the filter flow is slowing down.

Swapping the water would only add something toxic [Trites] to the water and what we are really trying to do in your cycling 30 is grow bacteria in the filter. The filter is where the action is.

I know you have had mas quantities of info thrown at you recently but one way to clarify what we are shooting for is to review the "cycling with fish" sticky --> http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aqua...ad.php?t=36492 {I am trying to save myself some typing there But we will be here for the coming questions on that topic }

yes the 20 has been up over a year and has ha no deaths or issues in a long time... Ok, good & thanks.

angels in there is temporary;noy going to keep them in there. just long enough to figure out a better plan. Yup

how should i proceed? you have led me well thus far... SHHH! You will ruin my reputation! ;-D & TYVM!
just keep doing water changes; how much do i feed???? Exactly, More WC it is and large ones due to the amount of stock you have. [In your cycling 30g ->] You want to maintain your ammonia BELOW .5 [.25 is ideal] but not at 0 because you need ammonia to feed your growing BB colony.
When you get your test kit you will be able to see exactly what your ammonia is and be able to determine the % of WC via math.

IE: If your ammonia is 1pp. a 75% WC brings it to .25. With heavily stocked tanks this is going to be a daily or nearly daily event [The % of WC is determined by your test results.]

Feed only what the fish will finish in 3 minutes - Not even kidding. I know it seems like a miniscule amount but it works, Promise. In fact, I would suggest the first time you try this you feed half the amount you usually do and see how that works [IMO - Most people overfeed and the extra food rots in the water and destroys your water quality].

Effectively, You take really good care of your water, You only feed the fish.

i have many more questions buy still reading... I bet

You have had a long night, Enjoy a video:

[Cermet]

With soft water and large water changes most likely the fish suffered from pH shock. This can be deadly and once done, little you can do. Changing the water again is worse than doing nothing.

In the future you need to either let the new water sit (so its pH can drift towards a value that better matches your tank water) or if that does not work, add a substrate that will make your in tank water harder. A pH of 6.5 and soft water can be an issue. Check your tap pH and I believe it willmeasure much higher.

If you are cycling you have an issue here - water changes are required but pH shock can be deadly. So, please post the pH of the tap and we can compare to your orginal pH values. Hopefully, this is not an issue.

[Honey Badger 1]

With soft water and large water changes most likely the fish suffered from pH shock.

This is a good theory and I also thought of it, but the second water change helped. If it was pH shock I think the second water change would have prolonged the problem.
If I remember correctly, and I could be wrong, the pH from her tap water is 7.0 and very soft and the pH in her tank is 6.5-7.0. There isn't anything in her tank that would drop or stabilize pH, only standard gravel and ornaments. Since her water is very soft and contains very little buffers, frequent water changes would replenish what little dissolved solids the tank water has to help stabilize the pH, at least stop huge fluctuations, for the short time between the frequent water changes needed during a cycle with fish. However a long term solution will probably be needed if the pH in the tank drops significantly between water changes.

[Kim S.]

First of all, Thank You from myself but my 6 yr old got up to no deaths!!!

20 gallon

Ph 7.0-7.2
NO3 40-80
No2 0
Ammonia 0.25

30 gallon
Ph 6.8-7
NO3 20
NO2 0
Ammonia .25

All fish are stable and swimming like usual!

What next?

[Honey Badger 1]

I would say a water change on that 20g to bring the nitrate and ammonia levels down. But first test the pH in the tap water and post the results here so we can see if there is a difference in the tap pH and the tank pH.

[Kim S.]

Ok my tap water is 7.0

[Azurescriber]

Your betta should stay by himself, those are not compatible tank mates.

Definitely return the gold fish...it will get too big and/or die from being overheated (they are a non-tropical fish)