Smk Shoe's 75g FOWLR

[Smk Shoe]

First Salt Water tank. Was going to do a 20 gal to get my feet wet but after talking to a couple guys at work and the local dealer in my area. decided on a 75g because 1. larger tanks are more forgiving 2. future upgrade won't be needed as soon 3. won't be quite so limited on amount of fish. tank was set up by the dealer and two weeks later added 6 fish. Two angels, two clown, and two dori's. about 14 inches total of fish so well under the 1/4 to 1/2 inch of fish per gallon. Tank was set up with about 75lbs of sand and about same of rock. One of the larger rocks he pulled from a established tank. Had a couple of early scare's. 1. One of the dori's after putting in the tank spent three hours hiding in the rocks on his side. Figured it wouldn't make it thru the night but finally came out and paired with the other exploring the new tank. 2. at night with only the lunar lights on both dori's will go to a corner of the tank and stay there. 3. the spotted angel fish spent about two hours after eating this afternoon swimming kinda on it's side. Seems okay now but was a little worrisome. I know that there is a little stress on the fish moving into a new tank, but will keep a eye on everyone. decided on the maintance plan for 4 months where the dealer comes out and does the filter change and water change. I'm sure i'll be able to do it later on but having a expert come over ever month to watch do it and have a experienced set of eyes check the tank is worth the money. Will post some pictures in a day or two along with a complete list of equipment.

[coachfraley]

The inches per gallon rule totally doesn't work for saltwater.

Sorry to say, but having 2 blue tangs in your tank is not going to work. I am VERY liberal about tank size and stocking, and I wouldn't put ONE blue tang in a 75g. It would work for the short term, but I have seen a blue tang outgrow a 180g tank, so one would outgrow a 75 for sure.

If you want a tang, you can go with one of the smaller varieties like a yellow or a kole. Although some folks will disagree, they are definitely a better choice than a blue.

[Cliff]

Good call starting off with a larger tank. That will certainly help make things a little easier for you

I'm just curious as to what you are using for filtration ? As you have 75 lbs of live rock, are you using the filter for chemical filtration ?

Just a word of caution about your spotted angelfish. Most of the marine angels that go by the common name of "spotted angelfish" can get very large most of them well over 12 inches in length. 12 inches is also about the size you blue tang will get as well. Although both of those fish will grow very slowly after reaching about 6 to 8 inches, they will end up getting around a foot in length.

I'm looking forward to see some pic of your tank

And Welcome to the forum :22:

[Smk Shoe]

I think I may have been calling the dori's by the wrong name. Dealer I bought them from used that as a common name but also said they wouldn't get over about two inches. Took pictures but trying to figure out if I can post straight to the forum or need to open a photo bucket account.

[Cliff]

Does your blue tang look like the one in the below pic ?

http://i938.photobucket.com/albums/ad226/Cliff_Erhardt/Cliff%20fish%20tank%20pics/HippoandBangii.jpg

[Smk Shoe]

Think I may have it figured out. Playing with a new Imac is killing me, but think I have one of the angels ready

[Smk Shoe]

Yep, just like the one on the right.

[Cliff]

Nice looking fish

Looks like you have a young Queen Angelfish (Holacanthus ciliaris) and two blue regal (Paracanthurus hepatus) tangs, sometimes commonly called hippo tangs.

That angel will grow to about 18 inches in length and the hippo tangs to around 12 inches.

You'll have to watch those fish carefully and be ready to re-home them when they start to grow too big for your tank. You don't want them to become stunted. These guys can grow pretty fast up until around 6 inches when their growth rates will slow down, but the will get very large at some point.

[Smk Shoe]

Here is what I hope a picture of the tank and each fish

[Cliff]

That is a nice looking and very young Emperor Angelfish (Pomacanthus imperator) in the second picture. He too will out grow your tank as he will get to be about 14 to 16 inches in length. Just goes to show the benefits of doing your own research before getting fish. Now your will have to worry about finding new homes for 4 big fish at some point. You have to keep in mind, most fish store are more interested in selling you fish, and less interested in you having a well planning marine aquarium.

In your original post you have mentioned you were using a filter. I'm just curious as to what you are using for filtration ? As you have 75 lbs of live rock, are you using the filter for chemical filtration?

[Smk Shoe]

Cliff, once you see the rest of the fish, can you give me a expected time that I'll need to be upgrading tanks. I knew eventually I would be adding another, but want to make sure I'm really knowing what I'm doing first. Learned alot just reading thru the forum last night. But also feel a lot dumber reading the posts. A lot more involving than was led to believe. Seems I need to get in the books to make sure I'm covering all bases. Don't want to do this half***.

[Cliff]

I'm not too sure about the angels, but it would likely take those two hippo tangs around 2 years (give or take) before they will get up to the size were they could no longer be in a 75 gallon tank. Maybe a little longer. I am basing that guess on my hippo tang growing from 1.5 inches to 4 inches in the first year that I had him.

Also, it looks like we posted at the same time. Did you noticed my last post?

[Smk Shoe]

Yes, give me a little time and I'll post my entire setup. complete setup was put together by the dealer ( husband and wife ) locally. From the guys around that have SW tanks, he is the one and only to go to. Unless you wanna risk pet smart shopping.

[Smk Shoe]

Here is the run down of all that I have for equipment.

75g tank ( of course)
Penguin 350 Bio-wheel
Fluval heater ( 300W)
Odyssea powerhead Ex-250 ( 250 gallon per hour max)
Odyssea light with digital timer T-5 lamps blue and white, Blue LED for lunar
Temp strips on right near bottom and I added one on left near top
large net
API master test kit

Food
San Francisco frozen angel and butteryfly diet
San Francisco frozen Emerald Entree for all Omnivorous

How's it look so far, Dealer seems real knowledgeable but some "just do this and everything will be good". I like to know the what and why to make sure I am doing the right thing for the right reason. 26 years active duty army, I don't like to "just do something" because.

[Cliff]

I do not recommend using a bio-wheel for your biological filtration. Especially when your live rock will provide all the filtration that you need. However, you could remove the bio-wheels from the filter and use it for flow and for chemical filteration such as phosphate removers and chemi-pure. That would help your set-up to remain healthy. That would be a very good use of the HOB filter.

I would also suggest a skimmer. This will go a long way to help maintain very good water parameters.

I did not see some of the test kits or a refactormeter in your list of equipment. Knowing and managing you levels for: Salinity, nitrates, phosphates, calcium, alkalinity and pH will be important even for a FOWLR set-up. That will help to ensure a long-term health of your fish and set-up along with helping you avoid or minimize problems with things like nasty algaes.

I would also suggest at least one more power head. You system seams to be pretty low flow. Good water flow will also help your live rock filter the water better

The below links can provide you with some more detailed information about the recommendations that I have made


http://saltwater.aquaticcommunity.com/2012/the-importance-of-water-flow-and-movement-2/

http://saltwater.aquaticcommunity.com/2012/mixing-saltwater/

http://saltwater.aquaticcommunity.com/2012/protein-skimmers/

http://saltwater.aquaticcommunity.com/2012/ph-in-marine-aquariums/

http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aquariumforum/showthread.php?t=76398

http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aquariumforum/showthread.php?t=80662

[Smk Shoe]

thanx, I'll do some more reading and research the links you posted. I do have a test kit from API ( saltwater master test kit). Do you think with what I have, I should be good for awhile as I figure everything out. I don't want to rush into any uninformed decisions. Biggest thing is to keep the fish happy and healthy for now.
Question- how do the blue regal tang's sleep at night. Mine both find a corner at night and lay there. they mover around a little but I would think small fish would find a hiding place for the night.

[Cliff]

I would say that is a sound approach. You can take your time before buying any other equipment. As long as your ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and ph are normal, and your doing 10 to 20% weekly water changes, your fish will be fine for a little while. All of my recommendations have been based on helping you with the long-term success of your tank.

Hippo tangs do like to find hiding spots to sleep in. Mine has found a spot between two rocks that he will use. He goes there to sleep or when he is spooked. As the angels will also find a spot in the rocks, your hippo tangs have likely picked a spot away from them them, at least that would be my guess. As long as they are eating and acting normal I would not worry to much about it.

[hockeyhead019]

I wouldn't worry about their sleeping habits too much as long as they look healthy and active during the day...

Everything that Cliff has said has been spot on. My only additional piece of advice is to take the SW guy's advice with a couple grains of salt (the one you bought the tank from) sure you can have all of those fish in there and they may do ok for a while, heck they may do ok for a long time but they will hit a stunted point and not to mention those are 4 very large fish, meaning they produce a ton of waste which means your tank could teeter on the edge of crashing. But just my $.02 take it or leave it haha

On a more upbeat note I like your setup a lot! Very refreshing compared to the typical layouts we see

[Smk Shoe]

Quick question, How often would you feed this setup. Using frozen cubed food right now. Dealer said two cubes of the two different types every other day. Does that seem right. Fish right now arn't acting like they are starving i.e. trying to munch on the rocks or feeding at the serface or tasting everything in the tank

[hockeyhead019]

As long as they're eating everything you're feeding them they'll be fine

[Smk Shoe]

Already think I have a issue. Emperior angel didn't have this on it's tail two days ago and pretty sure it wasn't there yesterday. Any help on what it is and what to do about it. Kinda worried since I havn't added anything to the tank since I got the fish.

[Cliff]

Ouch, That is a isopod attached to your fish

http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aquariumforum/showthread.php?t=85005

Those are nasty and will slowly kill your fish. You might have to manually remove the isopods from your system but I would suggest trying a parasite treatment first. I would suggest catching your angel and try a medicated dip of prazipro following the instructions on the bottle. If that gets rid of the isopod, then administer two treatments to your whole tank 5 days apart following the instructions on the bottle.

There are two risks you need to be aware of when using prazipro in a marine tank. If you have flatworms in your system, the prazipro will kill them as well and the dieing flat worms can release enough toxins into the water to stress and/or kill you fish. You have to make sure you to not have any flat worms (a quick Google for pics can help you with that).

The prazipro will affect your tank water in one of two ways depending on your equipment. When you use skimmers or HOB filters, it can cause a lot of micro bubbles, and I mean a lot. That can stress some fish so you will have to keep an eye on that. Or, Prazipro will reduced the amount of oxygen in the water so it would be a good idea to have a bubbler running while you have the meds in the tank.

[smaug]

Cliff got it right for the isopod. Get that fksh out of the tank and into a seperate qt. The pod is external and could be killed with cupramine but do it in a qt for sure. Isos like that one you have are thankfully not that common so I wouldn't freak about having an infestation in the dt just yet. Be careful if you ma.ually remove the pod,I have read that they can bite through human skin as well.

[Smk Shoe]

Just looked and now its not on the angel. Gotta find it now

[Smk Shoe]

Also, thanx for the replies. Was kinda freaked out for awhile

[Smk Shoe]

Hopefully after it got a free ride on the angel, the angel got a free meal. but will keep looking for it

[Cliff]

If you re-cure your rock in complete darkness for about 3 or 4 months and replace all of your substrate, that should get rid of the isopods.

The only problem would be that you would need to have some cured rock to add to your tank while your current rock is re-curing. But it might allow you to get rid of the isopods without using any meds. Just another option (all be it a big pain in the backside) to consider if you do not want to use meds

http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aquariumforum/showthread.php?t=76703

[icefreeze57]

whatever happned here? Would love to see your tank