To Skim or Not To Skim

[Adimondinthesky]

Hi~ I am new here to this site and to saltwater aquariums. I bought a 12 gallon thinking it would be cheaper and easier...after studying up..I really wish that I had bought a larger tank. But since I have spent a small fortune on this one, it will have to wait.
My actual question is...I have 1 bio filter running and 1 duetto filter running, which creates a lot of micro bubbles. I have it facing the back of my tank so it doesn't cloud the water. Do I really need a protein skimmer? I really don't know where I would put it, that's the main reason I would like to avoid getting one. I also have some live rock that I received a couple of days ago, and I have some live substrate that I have not put in until the live rock cycles the tank. At least that is what I was told to do. I also made the mistake of adding water conditioners and so far, no amonia is showing up to show that my tank is actually cycling.

[kkyyllee]

dont bother with a skimmer u dont need it, weekly water changes will work, how much liverock do you have? is this going to be a reef?, you add the livesand in now, if you wait till after the cycle it could cause a small one

[Adimondinthesky]

To be honest, I am not sure if I want a reef or fish only tank. Since I am new, I was planning on fish only, but I sure like the looks of the live rock with the soft corals. I have, guessing about 15 pounds of rock, it's been in the tank for 2 days now. I have also been adding liquid calcium daily. I would love to put the sand in now, Thanks so much for letting me know! Also for your reply!

[coachfraley]

Adding to Kkyyllee's questions...Can you be more specific about your filtration: What bio filter? What are you running in the duetto? Why are you adding calcium?

You might be able to just get rid of the duetto and add a small powerhead.

[Fishguy2727]

A protein skimmer would definitely not hurt, only help.

Where did he say he was adding calcium?

[coachfraley]

I have also been adding liquid calcium daily.

In post #3

[Adimondinthesky]

I have an Eclipse aquarium with the filter in the hood and then the duetto with a bio sponge and carbon cartridge.

I was adding the liquid calcium for the live rock, to hopefully keep the coralline algae.

Maybe I should take out the duetto and get a Nano Skimmer, has anyone heard how good those work?

Also, just added live sand, now I have a white film on the inside of the glass. Is that normal?

[Fishguy2727]

What is your calcium concentration? (in the tank)

Can you add a nano-skimmer without removing the duetto?

[Adimondinthesky]

I am really not sure of my calcium...I just ordered a test kit and have not received it yet. Should I stop adding it until I get the kit?

I could move the duetto to the other side, I will just have to drill a hole in the hood for the cords. I was just hoping to not have more things in the aquarium since it is small already. :)

[coachfraley]

Maybe I am missing something, but I don't understand why you need the duetto, isn't it doing the exact same thing as the filter in your hood (mechanical & chemical filtration)??? You shouldn't need any "bio" filter media because of your live rock. If it were me, I would get it out of there and get a powerhead instead.

Adding sand always clouds up the water for a while, that is normal.

I would not add any CA unless you need to. IME, coraline algae can grow fine without any additives.

Research the skimmer carefully, I have read that some of the small ones don't work well at all.

[Fishguy2727]

But if those things will help increase the likelihood of success, they are worth the space.

[Adimondinthesky]

I don't understand how a powerhead would be better than another filter system..is it because it stirs everything up?

Another silly question..:) How do I know if a protein skimmer is good or not? I am not familiar with how it works different from a filter.

P.S. Thanks for all the replies!

[Fishguy2727]

Powerhead will just move water, a protein skimmer will help clean.

I would go with one with a venturi powered by a powerheard/small water pump. Do not get the ones with a wooden air block, they clog too quickly and need to be replaced all the time.

[coachfraley]

Mechanical filtration on a saltwater tank needs to be cleaned constantly, otherwise it becomes a "trap" for nitrates. Some people choose not to use it at all for that reason.

Keeping 2 mechanical filters on one tank would not really improve your water quality, it would just double your cleaning duty. The purpose of a powerhead is to provide extra water flow, which is an important part of a healthy SW tank.

You will need to read reviews of the skimmers to know which ones are any good. Before you buy one, search google or a "reef" forum to find out if people have had success with that particular unit.

EDIT: lol, you beat me to it fishguy...you are quick to the draw!!! If fishguy has tried that skimmer, you should just listen to him...it will save you a lot of time!!!

[Adimondinthesky]

Ok, what if I have the Eclipse filter, the powerhead, 15 lbs of live rock and live Aragonite substrate with 10% water changes each week. Would I still need a protein skimmer? With the 12 G Eclipse aquarium, it is just really hard to find one that will work. The Nano looks to be the only one that would possibly work with this tank, but the feedback on it is horrible.

[melanie]

I have a 10 gallon saltwater tank and I don't use a protein skimmer. It would be nice to have one but I can't find any locally that are for smaller tanks or have setup info in English.
I just make sure to do 10-20% weekly water changes with aged water and test the ammonia and such 2xs a week and check my water level everyday because it is very hot here and I have a fan on the surface of the water to keep the temperture down.
I haven't lost any fish yet and the person I got the fish and tank from was only doing a 25% monthly water change. The clownfish seem much more energetic now that I have them, exploring the entire tank and dumping mouthfuls of gravel on the starfish.
The only kind of mechanical filter I have is a Tetra One Touch Auto that is used to keep the water circulating and remove and larger pieces for food floating around. My other biological filtration is live sand and live rock.
All that said I'm still a beginner myself, this is my first tank and I've only had it for a little over a month although it is about a year up and running.
So what kind of fish were you thinking of?

[coachfraley]

Well, let me give you my $.02.

I think that without a skimmer AND without a refugium, it is going to be tougher to maintain good water quality. You will have to be religious about water changes, keep your stocking low, monitor your feeding closely, and watch your parameters or you will get algae blooms like crazy. As you can see from Melanie's post, it can be done, but the skimmer and the fuge make it a lot easier.

I do not have a skimmer on my 12g, but I do have a small refugium with chaeto growing in it. I do 25% water changes every week, and my nitrates are routinely between 0 and 5.

Some people run macro in their displays to help out with the nitrates, but that is a whole other can of worms:c12:

[Adimondinthesky]

I am thinking of just keeping a pair of clownfish and maybe a blenny for the sand... I keep reading about needing to get cleaner fish before you buy regular fish, but I don't know much about that either.

I have a 55G with 5 Blood Parrots and they are so much fun to watch and they recognize me and they have such great personalities. I have had them for almost 2 years and they are just happy and healthy as can be, so I am thinking that I have mastered freshwater...I will try saltwater, and I have to admit, I knew it would be more involved and costly but my head is spinning today! :c4: I don't mind doing maintenance everyday but I have bought so much that I don't need and not enough of what I do need! I have seen so many aquarium kits for saltwater that just had the filter, heater, hydrometer and salt..I thought, I can do that! Well, I am learning....day by day, it may be 6 months before I am brave enough to buy my first fish though!

[Fishguy2727]

A skimmer is a chemical filter, not really a mechanical filter. And the best thing about skimmers is that they remove the waste from the system, whereas other filters simply trap it until you remove it, that is where you get nitrate problems. Once the goo is deposited in the collection cup in the skimmer, it is no longer affecting the water.

The Current USA Fission Nano Skimmer is supposed to be good. They carry and recommend it at one of the best reef places in the area. It is what I plan on using for my tank once I get it setup.

[2manyfish]

I have no experience with the small skimmers that are available now. Like Coachfarley said, check around on various forums to see if a particular brand involved is worth the money.
When I had nanos, I never used a skimmer, instead I relied on water changes. I also never added any chemicals (ie; calcium). Your salt mix will replenish all this*. And BTW it is never a good idea to dose anything to your tank that you can't test for. Because you've been adding calcium everyday to such a small tank and nothing in there using it up, your pH could be through the roof. Do you have any test kits at all? If not, take a sample to your LFS and have them test it for you....

May I ask where you were storing your live sand before you added it to your tank? I can't imagine anyone suggesting to not add this immediately...





*In most cases your salt mix will have everything you need for your tank. There are exceptions and that is if you plan on having several clams or a large amount of SPS corals in your tank. Even then, you will need a test kit to see when to dose and how much to dose.

[Adimondinthesky]

I have read so many things, one thing saying that if you want coraline algae on your live rock, you need to add calcium... that is what is so confusing on top of the difficulty of it all, when you get conflicting information..I know there isn't a set way but wow! So I have stopped adding the calcium. I do have test kits for just about everything else and my PH is actually 8.0, which may be a bit low.

I was told my an online pet store to add the live sand after the rock cycled the aquarium..I just bought the Aragonite Reef Substrate in the 16 lb bag. But since I found this website, I was told to add it, so it is looking great in there now with my rock. :)

I would be majorly happy to change the water, and live without the skimmer..

Would a UV sterilizer be a smart purchase?

[coachfraley]

This should actually be a fun time in your SW experience. While the Liverock cycles, you should be able to see critters of some sort appear out of your liverock. If you don't see anything during the day, check out your tank with a flashlight after the lights have been off for a while, and you might see some creepy critters!

Don't get discouraged, remember you are supposed to be having fun:c5:

BTW, how about getting some pictures up?????

[Adimondinthesky]

Hey, Thank You for reminding me, I needed that! I was getting so confused!
I think I am all better now thumbs2: Still a bit clueless, but better!

What does it mean if I don't see any critters? I haven't seen anything since I received them.

[Fishguy2727]

If there is a good UV sterilizer for that size tank it wouldn't hurt, just like the protein skimmer.

[mariusz621]

I have read so many things, one thing saying that if you want coraline algae on your live rock, you need to add calcium... that is what is so confusing on top of the difficulty of it all, when you get conflicting information..I know there isn't a set way but wow! So I have stopped adding the calcium. I do have test kits for just about everything else and my PH is actually 8.0, which may be a bit low.

I was told my an online pet store to add the live sand after the rock cycled the aquarium..I just bought the Aragonite Reef Substrate in the 16 lb bag. But since I found this website, I was told to add it, so it is looking great in there now with my rock. :)

I would be majorly happy to change the water, and live without the skimmer..

Would a UV sterilizer be a smart purchase?
I would not add any calcium as the tank is small and you can easly get it out of balance. Coraline algae will grow regardless of you adding extra calcium. There will be a time when you want it to stop growing so much:ezpi_wink1:

If you can keep up with water changes then you may be ok without skimmer. If I had tank your size with a space for a skimmer I would add one. I have 30l nano tank without a skimmer which runs ok. The only reason I did not add one is lack of space. I do 50% water change weekly to make sure everything is ok.