Hello and need help for a friend!

[Tracey T]

Hello, I am Tracey from NY. I have a fan tailed goldfish who is doing well.
My question is for my friend who I have been trying to help unsuccessfully.
She has 5 fish, 1 fish got dropsy. Pine coned appearance. Stopped eating. She had them all in a small 10 or 15 gallon tank and had NOT been using a gravel siphon to clean the bottom of the tank. She got a larger tank, and I suggested she MOVE the other 4 fish before they got sick too. Here are the 2 questions I have:
(1) sick fish, still swimming well, on day 4.5 of tx with Maracyn 2, I discovered she had NOT taken the filter out. I had her add another packet immediately. Fish went almost 8 days w/o eating. On day 9 started excreting large amounts of #2 in the water. Started eating again. Swimming well. Pine coned appearance appears better. So really, fish has only had 5 days of pure medication our of 9 due to the filter. Does she count that as 1 full week cycle (she wants to treat x2) or does she continue for another 2 days and then start cycle #2? Also, there is a LARGE build up of #2. Should she scoop up what she can by hand and not disturb the water or do a 25% water change only. Im afraid the medicine quality in the water will be affected?
(2) Healthy fish--3 of 4 have slight fin rot, swimming well, eating well. Seem healthy. In new tank, VERY cloudy. Know tank needs to cycle. I gave her handful of my gravel +water to add to help introduce good bacteria. She has performed (before my gravel) one 25% water change in 1 week. Should she continue with 25% every week? I have read that introducing a bacteria starter isnt a good thing for a new tank (b/c most is dead and produces by products) is this true? Any advice there? I know it can take up to 8 weeks or more to cycle regularly. She is just worried.

Should add---she is a newbie to fish and does not test the water quality (up to this point she was scooping the waste from the gravel so MUCH has built up and Im sure nitrate levels are high)

Thanks so much, I only know so much myself and have learned greatly from other with more experience and expertise. Thank you in advance.

[Tracey T]

Should have mentioned all are regular goldfish.

[Michael Milligan]

I don't know what the medication is for, but that WHILE cycling bound to be a tough one.

Give your friend 1/2 of the filter media in your tank to put in hers. Then cycle will be fast.

Gold fish make lots of "#2". BIG water changes are fine. It is important to use a gravel vac, so perhaps gift her one. Keep it all nice and clean and her friends should get better and live for many, many years.

[Lady Hobbs]

First, you only need to post a question one time. Secondly, you need to post goldfish questions in the goldfish thread, not the introduction thread.

So, to your questions. Regular goldfish are common goldfish. They get 10-12" long and do not belong in fish tanks the size you are talking about. They generally are kept in HUGE tanks or ponds.

You mentioned your friend did not remove the filter when she medicated. You don't remove the filter. You only remove the charcoal if you're using it. Medication depletes oxygen in the tank and she must use a filter plus it wouldn't hurt to add an air stone when treating with medications.

She needs to clean the bottom of the tank out with a gravel vac. Scooping out poop is hardly useful with your hands. Goldfish are very dirty fish and get dirtier as they grow. They should have large water changes, a couple times a week if needed and the tank kept clean of waste.

Sounds to me as that fish was very constipated. Possibly from over feeding. If she is only feeding flake food, she would probably be best to switch to pellets (which cause less constipation issues) and cut down of the feeding.

There is definately a problem between cloudy water, fin rot, constipation, bloat and all these other problems. You mentioned she got a larger tank but not how much larger. There is just too many fish with poor water conditions kept for them.

Some of the bacteria boosters are helpful when cycling but should be added to a tank with 0 ammonia. Do you have a test kit?

[Tracey T]

My apologies for not posting properly. Thank you so much for your quick replies.

Sick goldfish--she has the filter running, removed charcoal after day 4.5. She did purchase a gravel vac after my suggestion (she was using the net to clean).
Has not used it yet, b/c of medication in water. I will go over to show her how to use the gravel vac.....do I wait until medication treatment is over? Or do 25% water changes every couple of days with meds in water? (how much will this effect med rates in water?) Goldfish looks like classic dropsy case, pine coned appearance. Still VERY bloated, although still swimming well and now eating.

New tank I think is 30 gallon. Not currently being treated at all with meds. Only thing introduced is my gravel + water. Fin/tail rot was from other tank. Do not see it progressing in new tank. Fish are about 1 to 1.5 inches long (the larger one may be 2) and there are 4 in tank. Would you recommend doing 25% water changes or adding a bacteria boost, and if the latter, which one would you recommend?

Thank you so much.

[KatzeSlaugen]

the meds should tell you when to do the water change. changing water while dosing meds will dilute the meds causing them to be less effective.

adding water from a cycled tank doesnt do anything from a new tank, gravel can help though..

[Lady Hobbs]

No problem with your post. It would have not gathered much attention in the Introduction thread so I thought it should be moved to grab some posts.

As long as you had charcoal running in the filter, the meds probably didn't do much good. It would depend on how old that charcoal is. It depletes after 2-4 weeks, depending on how good the charcoal is, so if you had used that same cartridge for awhile, then it probably removed no meds. If it was fairly new, it would have. But that medication has a big caution on it to not overdose.

Dropsy can be caused by a number of things but poor water quality is said to be one of them. Is it possible the fish was stunted because it could also be from growing internally and his organs became cramped. It's not a disease but a condition.

There's a "slight" chance that epsom salt treatments may help reduce the build up of fluids. They are treated in a pail for 15 minutes or so in a epsom salt bath then returned to the tank. Sometimes takes several treatments. Some add the epsom salt right to the tank but not sure that's a wise idea in case the fish doesn't react well to it. You don't use much, only like a teaspoon. You should finish treating with the meds and if the fish has not improved you could try the epsom salt.

You do not want to use any aquarium salt. That retains water but epsom reduces it. And make sure you have enough oxygen too because medication depletes it.

Hoping someone else will jump in here because I've never treated a fish with this problem before. I have read it's nearly always fatal but I hope you can get yours to pull thru. I don't think I'd be feeding him much at all right now.

[MCools]

I'm no expert, but if the fish is that bloated I would go 24 hours without feeding it anything. Then i would follow it up the next day with a pea or two. Just thaw a frozen pea, run it under hot water for a minute or so then shell it so you get 2 halves. Depending on the size of the fish you may have to squish the pea more so that the fish can eat it. Peas are very good for clearing up constipation, so they may help.

There's a thread around here somewhere that gets into treating with epsom salt, if I can find it I'll post a link for you.

[Tracey T]

thanks so much! I will pass the info along to my friend.

[Tracey T]

Just wanted to post a quick update regarding my friend's sick fish:
~~The fish is doing great. First, the pine coning disappeared. Then the bloat went away. (This was after doing frequent and large water changes, cleaning the tank/filer (It was REALLY bad) and adding epsom salt directly to the tank following completion of the 2nd round of Maracyn 2).
~~The fish did develop black spots, a result of too much ammonia in the water. With more frequent water changes., those disappeared too.

~~Now the fish is eating normally, swimming and pooping normally. Truly, a fish miracle. We've re-named him "Lucky", b/c well, he is!

I am checking in on them weekly. Other fish (removed after 1st fish got sick) are also doing well. She is now maintaining 2 tanks.

Thank you all for your advice and caring. Its nice to know there are knowledgeable fish people (not the ya-hoos at the fish stores) out there who will lend a ear to help others.

Tracey

[MCools]

I'm glad to hear the fish is better!:ssmile: