KILLING animals

[crackatinny]

Sorry for the vicious sounding title, but another thread got me thinking.

In my younger days, I would go shooting, trapping, ferreting, without a thought, don't get me wrong, we would eat what we killed.
These day's I cant step on an ant, without feeling bad.
Dad was the same, I grew up with fresh killed lamb or chicken, but in his later years, he said he could no longer do it (not for physical reasons, just could not bring himself to do it)

Does this happen with age, I am only a bit of a kid at 39.

Responses with age would be interesting.

(my other theory, is losing loved ones makes us softer as we edure life)

Any other theories?

[Rue]

Are you 39?

Well, I could never kill anything...unless it was suffering. I know we had to euthanize healthy animals at the vet clinic...so I could do it...part of the job...but that was the worst.

But I'm anti-hunting - not for meat, but for 'fun'. If you really need the meat, then the hunting is fine. But I'm appalled at Big Game and trophy hunting. How can you take pleasure in posing with dead animals and in the same breathe expounding on their beauty? You KILLED the beauty...dumb*sses.

I'm also not the type to use up every option to keep a sick animal alive - if its sick, it should be put down humanely.

If it helps you guys understand my POV...

...I cry at roadkill...:(

[crackatinny]

Well I guess I am not just a softy afterall Rue.
Worst part is, on a vets point of veiw, I am to soft even there these days, a few months ago, i found a young bird fell out of a nest at work, I took it home, bought a little carry cage, rang the vet and took it down, it had a broken leg, and a broken beak, they wanted to kill it, and I said I can't, I have to give it any chance it had, I bought a syringe and formula, made a warm nest for it in its cage, and it was really responding, but died through the night.
It was not an act of cruelty, I spent $30 just to try to save this little fella. I had a dog when I was young, that got parvo, the vet told me straight it would die, and wanted to put him down, I said no, I sat with this fella in his cage at the vets as long as they would allow, next morning I went in, and they was in shock, he was up walking around, that afternoon I took him home, he lived many years after that

[Rue]

That's not as extreme as I meant...

...I meant like the lady who insisted on looking after a sick cat - ended up with toxoplasmosis and lost her baby...she was 7 m. pregnant...

...or the woman that spent close to $7000 for open heart surgery for her dog...that also had a host of other issues (puppy mill dog)...

...or the man who spent $12000 on a 15 year old cat...who died despite his best efforts...

[Drumachine09]

I dont see whats wrong with taxidermy.

I have taken many an animal, and i have several nice mounts.

Yes, i took them for meat, but also because of the specimen. The only way to trully apreciate the beauty of an animal after it has been taken, is to wake up every morning and have a 10 point buck staring you in the face. Would you rather have the animals skin just thrown away?

Taking a deer can be a VERY memorable experiance. I remember when i was 9 sitting there in the cold. Just waiting. Beautiful 6 pointer walked into view, and i took him. The mount serves the same purpose as a picture, except its 10x as memorable.

Also, killing pests is a big thing. I could sit outside and see a dozen squrrels in 3 minutes. Letting the population get out of hand can be harmfull. If you let too many specimens of the same species occupy the same niche, then the food will become scarce, and you will have suffering animals. On a good day, i can get half a dozen squirrels without even trying.

Also, crows are a big problem. Me and my neighbor drive out into the country, and our clients pay us 50 cents a crow. Our biggest bill was 23.50.

I guess its all a matter of your enviornment growing up. I was brought up to respect nature, and to do whats possible to help to protect it. By thinning the population, i am protecting the enviornment.


Its all just a matter of view points.

[Rue]

...nothing wrong with taxidermy per se...but I wouldn't kill an animal just to mount it...

...they look much better alive...

[Drumachine09]

...nothing wrong with taxidermy per se...but I wouldn't kill an animal just to mount it...

...they look much better alive...


Well, some people do that, and as long as they do it in a respectable manner (ie: not this mount:[Only Registered Users Can See Links.]), it doesnt bother me.

[xoolooxunny]

as long as there is enough food to eat, the squirrels will reproduce in mass quantities. if the food source is limited, so will the litters of them in the spring. Animals have evolved to control their own populations, and if you really think about it, it's the human population that is completely out of control and damaging to the environment, but you don't see our population being 'thinned out'. Why should the animals get the short end of the stick? After all, they know how to take care of this planet better than we ever could.

BTW Rue, roadkill makes me sad too.

[Drumachine09]

as long as there is enough food to eat, the squirrels will reproduce in mass quantities. if the food source is limited, so will the litters of them in the spring. Animals have evolved to control their own populations, and if you really think about it, it's the human population that is completely out of control and damaging to the environment, but you don't see our population being 'thinned out'. Why should the animals get the short end of the stick? After all, they know how to take care of this planet better than we ever could.

BTW Rue, roadkill makes me sad too.

That is where you are wrong. Look at new york city. There were so many deer in that area, they actually considered shurring down central park for a week to "control the population"

[fishntrips]

well in response to the above posts, I would rather see the 10 point buck alive in his splender. and isnt NY over populated with people???? I do realise that deer etc are ferel animals and we do have a bad problem with ferel cats in oz but being a wildlife carer for 14 years i have personnally seen what these mad humans can do with a gun just for fun and then i have to pick up the pieces and repair their damage. now in Oz it is debatable that the kangaroo is a pest but i will tell you some of the animals that have suffered for fun. wombat came to me burnt 4 paws, side of face and ears that burnt to the head, why some hunter decided to kill mother and use baby for a football and she ran through the camp fire to get away. she (wombles) now lives happily had has just had baby of her own. red kangaroo (hobo) hunter wanted to take home a joey to keep for his own, thought it would impress the wife. hense didnt know what they were doing and fed him cows milk. Cows milk is FOR COWS not kangaroo joeys. BY the time i got him it was too late and he soon passed on, poor little critter was so ill. see now you have me on my soapbox. crackatinny ... maybe it does come with age as i feel im more soft now than then its black and white to me now no grey areas like when i was younger.

[Drumachine09]

There is only one soloution for feral cats. A light .223, ONLY if taken ethically though. I wont take a shot i cant make, and i do my damn best to make it as quick as possible.

[hungryhound]

Good question Crackatiny,

You wanted ages to gauge responses by age so here is mine:25.

To me life and death is a part of nature. Ecosystems depend on it herbivores killing plant species to keep them in check and predators killing herbivorous to keep them in check. Without killing the balance would be lost.

The fact of the matter is that we are responsible for killing living beings everyday. Every time we eat a steak, chicken breast, or turkey leg an animal had to die to feed us. Every time we eat a salad a plant had to die. Heck, every time we walk outside we are stepping on ants and other insects killing them. When we wash our hands we are killing bacteria. Killing is unavoidable and we all do it everyday.

Most just don't consciously think that an animal plant had to die to go on their dinner table because society no longer requires each individual person to butcher and harvest their own food, which has removed us emotionally from the ecological niche humans fulfill as the top predator in all ecosystems.

As little as 2 to 3 hundred years ago our ancestors had to fight and claw to get enough sustenance to survive. To them a deer would represent food and the ability to fight off the hunger in their bellies for another week. In their world you either killed or harvested food or you died. The worry about food was constant and I doubt anyone gave much thought to killing.

Our farming and husbandry techniques have made it so people do not even have to hunt and gather themselves anymore. We can go to a store and have more choices than kings and Queens had. Food is no longer a limiting resource in our life. As such we have time to ponder where it comes from and make the choice to only eat certain things. For the first time in our history humans can choose not to eat a readily available food and not starve. This abundance of food allows our society to ponder the ethical and moral issues of the food we eat.

To me killing is not a bad thing. It is the way of the world, but most of us are so far removed from the killing and processing of food that we lose site that it was how our ancestors and every animal and plant survives on this world.

Edit. I think that I need to calrify my position a little bit.

Killing for food = fine
Killing for research = fine
Killing for sport = bad
Dog fighting = bad

I guess I am okay with it as long as it serves a purpose other than entertainment.

[Lady Hobbs]

My mother was a big deer hunter. When I was a kid I used to pray she would not get one but she got at least one every single year...more often two. I think enough get killed by cars every year to help balance nature. I live in deer country and several are killed daily. (I've hit 3 myself)

Farmers that have livestock threatened by wolves is another story, animals that start venturing into towns and are a threat to people, bears invading campsites, etc.

Killing for the sake of killing I don't like but nature does have to have a balance. I think right now it's pretty much open season on kangaroo's as way too many are taking over farmlands. Farmers do need to protect the crops and livestock.

[crackatinny]

I think as age goes on, the sensitivity to this sort of thing grows, whether it be threw our own life experiences and losses or just maturing.
I eat meat and always will, but I could never kill that meat myself anymore.

[Drumachine09]

Well, we are on the top of the food chain for a reason.

[puddlekeeper]

(my other theory, is losing loved ones makes us softer as we edure life)

Any other theories?

Losing loved one's hasn't affected me except that it helped my come to terms with death ... but that is just me and my losses have been extreme.

I can shoot an animal with out a flinch ....

Just because this is becoming part of the fabric of your existence just means you are growing in a more compassionate manor.

There is nothing wrong with that unless you own and operate a slaughter house then it might be hard to make a living without some good employee's! :22:

[Lady Hobbs]

I have a friend who has those feral cats everywhere and they are all inter- breeding and having more liters as fast as they can pop them out. Neighbors keep feeding them anti-freeze and she wonders why. They probably are howling and carrying on all night and crapping in their flower beds. I wouldn't want them around either. If you want pets, keep them at home.