How to keep a fry tank cycled

[tesroberts]

OK, so I have 5 swimmers now, but now my once cycled tank is starting to "recycle". The nitrites are starting to climb a little. How do I keep my fry tank cycled with only a sponge filter? We've come this far with the angel fry, and I don't want to lose them because we're losing the cycled water.

[Lady Hobbs]

Over cleaning will kill your cycle in a heartbeat and also the addition of too many fish all at once..........such as a whole lot of unexpected fry.

You only rinse your filter media (sponge) out in old tank water so you don't kill the bacteria on it.

[tesroberts]

I haven't rinsed out our sponge yet, as we had a couple of fry on it that weren't swimming yet (they have since started swimming today), and I haven't done a lot of cleaning in other areas, for the same reason. I have only removed uneaten food and debris out of the water, avoiding areas where the fry were.
It is a 10g tank that started out with only 11 fry (we're down to 7 that we can find-5 swimming), so no bio-overload there. I'm just a bit confused about why the tank is starting to lose it's cycle. :think:

[Sasquatch]

If it's an old tank, it may not be loosing it's cycle at all. It may however have a population of bacteria that do the opposite of the cycle, eventually all the way to nitrogen gas.

This sometimes happens in old, dirty substrates. Bacteria use the oxygen trapped in nitrates and convert it back to nitrite, ammonia and eventually nitrogen gas. It's one of the reasons most people want to avoid anaerobic pockets in their substrate.

[tesroberts]

Hmmm. I stripped the tank bare (except for the decoration the fry were attached to). Could it be that my sponge has too much bacteria in it?
I don't have dangerous levels yet...but I don't want "yet" to come, if you know what I mean.

[tesroberts]

Sad to say, we lost all of our fry. The last one passed away last night. :scry:

Our tank definitely recycled. The Nitrites climbed up a bit and the ammonia level was up a small bit as well (but the ammonia came back down after I added some bacteria supplement and a 25% water change). My only guess was that maybe there was not enough bacteria in the sponge filter to maintain the tank.

Tonight we are moving some of our trusted tiger barbs into the fry tank to finish cycling the tank (they have cycled every single tank we own. thumbs2: ). Hopefully it will be finished by the time the next batch of eggs are laid (July 6th- our angels breed like clockwork. lol)

I was devastated to lose our fry, but this was our first attempt at it and we learned a lot from this. We should have more to work with, since I plan on moving the new batch while they're still eggs, rather than waiting for them to hatch into fry.

[rich311k]

Sorry about the fry. Good luck with the next batch.

[tesroberts]

Thank you.

It was fun to watch them grow...next time should be even more exciting. :)

[Lady Hobbs]

Next time, have a tank just for the babies and a sponge filter.

[tesroberts]

I did. I just removed the gravel out of the tank, so the fry wouldn't get stuck in it. We had been prepping this tank for months, in hopes we would have fry to put in it...it took 4 months to get the fry to put in there though. It was not a brand new tank. I just don't think we got enough bacteria in the sponge filter. :(

All the levels were perfect when I put the fry into it.

[Spardas]

Get a larger sponge filter and do daily water change next time if you see any spike in the levels. Just make sure the temp, pH, and TDS is the same.

I had cases where I had to quickly move fishes to another tank that's completely uncycled and I kept all the fishes alive with constant large water change. There were no spike in any of the levels in those period since I basically did 100% water change before I left for work and when I got home. I also added some bacteria booster each time and soaked it into the sponge filter as I was doing my water change. This is an extreme case but it can be done if it's an emergency. I had to keep 15 discus, 10 angels, and like 20 other smaller fishes in the uncycled 55 for nearly 2 months and all survived without any problems because I was on top of water quality. The growth rate didn't slow down either due to the water change. But again, this is not something for people who aren't willing to dedicate to water quality.

[tesroberts]

Thanks for the advice. I will remember that for the next round. :)

Going to use my trusty barbs to cycle this tank and hope it holds this time. I have soaked the sponge filter in bacteria supplement. :)

[Rob66]

hey tesroberts, i noticed you live in the sac area. i'm over here next to folsom. GL with the fry, hope they all do well

[little hawaii]

Angel fry should have 50-100% water changes every day, I was a breeder for 7 yrs.

[tesroberts]

Thanks for the advice. I'm keeping all this in mind, as we have another batch of eggs sure to come on the 6th (if my angels stay on the same clock).

@Robb66
cool, we're in the Folsom area ourselves. My hubby used to come in here (in fact, he created the "forum helper" sign that's being eaten by the angelfish), Marty, though he hasn't been to the forum in a long while.

[little hawaii]

Most of my pairs of angels would lay eggs every 11-12 days on the button. You should lean a piece of slate up against the glass, or even a short piece of PVC pipe. Then you can remove them for hatching elsewere. Watch for them to lay on the 12th day is my prediction. They should have a lot of high protien food to stay in breeding condition. It will make a big diff. in egg size, number, and hatch rates. But clean water is the big KEY. Enjoy, I miss my angels.

[Spardas]

Fully agreed with hawaii with his comments.

Breeder pairs need to be fed quality food as well as clean & stable water.

[tesroberts]

The tank that the parents are in is a very clean tank (our center piece if you will). We feed them a shrimp medley that they seem to love (so do the tetras that are in the tank as well).

They seem to be on the same time scale as usual, they have started their mating ritual and having their "fishy bits" starting to protrude. Looks like we'll have a batch on the 6th as I thought. :D I'm not sure why my breeding pair seem to be on a 28 day cycle, but they are and have been for months.

[DrNic]

When I was breeding angelfish I would always use bare bottom tanks with sponge filters for the fry. When the fry tank wasn't in use the sponge filter would live in the parents tank.

I found that it also helped to wipe down the tank, remove any uneaten food and change the water a lot to keep the parameters within norms.

[tesroberts]

This leads to to other questions...How do you change the water, and remove uneaten food without sucking up fry, or hurting them?

[Sasquatch]

Very carefully. ;-)

Use a small siphon and keep one hand pinching the hose. Scare away the babies with the hose pinched and when they're gone, siphon up the crud on the bottom.

[tesroberts]

ok, so we're waiting for them to be free swimming to clean the bottom (as some have fallen off the "furniture" onto the floor today). lol Most of the eggs have hatched today, so we're doing good. :)

[Lady Hobbs]

I've even used airline tubing to work as a siphoning hose. It's slow but you want it slow. Do water changes daily.

[superbsite]

I also use airline tubing. At the end of the tubing that goes in the tank I've put flat stone attached with a rubberband. The stone makes the tubing sink and the rubberband tightens it with a small gap to suck the waste food slowly; but be careful, invariably a nosy fry always come too close so you have to scare them off with the tubing.

I got one nosy fry in the pipe but because the gap was it was too small it didnt do thru and was still at the siphoning end. In this case what you need to do is put your finger on end where the water is coming out raise the pipe upwards to reverse the fry out in the tank.

Then continue again

Cheers