View Full Version : SA/CA cichlids in a 90gal?
rothenb1
05-04-2010, 04:54 PM
Does anyone have any input as to what generally peaceful SA/CA cichlids could live in a 90 gallon?
Right now we have two severum, a green and gold. We've also got clown loaches in there, so we know the tank will need to be upgraded in the near future. We're planning for a 180 gallon within the next year or so.
My other half is convinced we could house a green terror. I told him he was stone cold crazy, but apparently he's seen websites and other (ahem... anecdotal) evidence that people have kept green terrors peacefully.
These are the fish he is looking at:
Blue acara
Firemouth
Green terror
Geophagus (surinamensis or altifrons)
Convitcs
I have reservations about the green terror and convicts (obviously) as well as the geophagus because to my knowledge, they like to be in groups, and I just don't think we can add that many more fish without having a major bioload problem.
So right now we've got the two severum that are each 3 inches. There's only two clown loaches right now (had four, was planning to get two more, then two died from ich), and they are 4 inches. There's a tiny little redtail shark, maybe 1.5 inches. There's also a pearl and moonlight gourami, but I believe if he decides he wants these SA/CA cichlids they would need to be re-homed. Almost forgot, 3 otos. I forgot them because I never see them!
Any input would be greatly appreciated!
jaysee
05-04-2010, 05:08 PM
The gouramis would need to be rehomed for sure.
My vote is for firemouths.
rothenb1
05-04-2010, 07:33 PM
The only firemouths I've seen in the LFS in the area are half the size of the severums. Is that okay?
jaysee
05-04-2010, 08:06 PM
I'm not into cichlids, so I don't know about who goes with what. Firemouths are pretty laid back as far as cichlids go - that's about all I know. That and convicts are nasty buggers.
rothenb1
05-04-2010, 09:34 PM
Went to two LFS in the area and one man said balloon belly green terrors would be fine. I'm not taking my chances.
The other said that geophagus would be alright because they grow very slowly and by the time we upgraded they would just be hitting the point where they are too big for the 90. He also said firemouths can be nasty. Ah, so many contradicting opinions!
thatcichlidguy
05-05-2010, 12:45 AM
I'd steer clear of the balloon GTs. Those fish are deformed, more to the point they have a deformity fixed into the DNA of the strain. All told they were born and bred to be mutants. It's a terrible practice that should be stopped and NO LFS that sells them will even get my money.
With that said a GT in a 90 is fine, tankmates could be tricky. Getting them all as small juvies does help some. GT's can be slow growers but when small they do grow fairly quickly. That growth levels of between 6-8". For something that gets as large and aggressive as a GT, your really looking at more of a wet pet situation rather than a community in a 4' tank.
There is hope. Several species stay small enough and are reletively docile enough to work in a community setting in that size of tank. Most are SA rather than CA. A short list includes Laetacara dorsegera (commonly sold as curviceps cichlids) , Golden dwarf cichlids (nannacara anomala), Rams (Mikrogeophagus ramirezi), all of the Apistogramma genus (though many prefer very warm very soft acidic water) , Keyhole cichlids (Cleithracara maronii) . Many of the smaller true acaras such as Bujurquina vittata , Aequidens metae, Aequidens diadema , and the Krobia species.
CAs pose some interesting stocking issues. Even most of the smaller species are prone to being fairly aggressive. The result is normally that you end up with a species tank whether you like it or not. The only one that comes to mind that is relatively peacefull and likely to be found at your LFS lately is the Rainbow cichlid. Most other CAs that are commonly found are large and aggressive or just aggressive.
rothenb1
05-05-2010, 01:23 AM
The GT is really not an option as a tankmate because I already have the severums. I'm leaning toward the Geophagus surinamensis, do you think that's a good choice?
Lab_Rat
05-05-2010, 02:58 AM
I'd go with a colony of rainbow cichlids as tankmates for the severums. They're pretty cool little cichlids.
thatcichlidguy
05-05-2010, 03:54 AM
The GT is really not an option as a tankmate because I already have the severums. I'm leaning toward the Geophagus surinamensis, do you think that's a good choice?
Nope, your current tank's not big enough for a group of them. They get about 8" and are a social species so you'd want to have several of them. Might work out in a 150 though. If you did go with geos you'd also be looking at a sand substrate too since they need a substrate they can sift through. Personally I'd go for the smaller acaras. I've kept them with Sevs and they worked out quite well with them.
rothenb1
05-05-2010, 04:19 AM
Nope, your current tank's not big enough for a group of them. They get about 8" and are a social species so you'd want to have several of them. Might work out in a 150 though. If you did go with geos you'd also be looking at a sand substrate too since they need a substrate they can sift through. Personally I'd go for the smaller acaras. I've kept them with Sevs and they worked out quite well with them.
We're going to upgrade to a 180 in the near future due to the severum and the clown loaches. Even without the geos/whatever cichlid we decide to get, the tank's going to get bigger anyway :)
Do you happen to know how fast the geos grow?
We checked out the acaras today and it really didn't look good. There was one in there who was super aggressive and the rest of the acaras in there were practically half eaten. I'm sure that it's just that individual fish and most acaras aren't like that, but out of the 4 LFS in the area, this place was the only one that had acaras.
toddnbecka
05-05-2010, 04:20 AM
How about some of the Gymnogeophagus species? I have Norte and Catalan, both seem to be relatively peaceful species that don't grow too large. They're pair-bonding substrate spawners, and the Norte have paired off and spawned in a 45 (36"x18") among 6 others and 6 similar-sized cutteri w/out any real problems. They're actively guarding their brood of wigglers, but haven't taken over half the tank of gone psycho in general. I expect about the same from the Catalan, they should be pairing/spawning soon.
rothenb1
05-05-2010, 04:36 AM
How about some of the Gymnogeophagus species? I have Norte and Catalan, both seem to be relatively peaceful species that don't grow too large. They're pair-bonding substrate spawners, and the Norte have paired off and spawned in a 45 (36"x18") among 6 others and 6 similar-sized cutteri w/out any real problems. They're actively guarding their brood of wigglers, but haven't taken over half the tank of gone psycho in general. I expect about the same from the Catalan, they should be pairing/spawning soon.
Thanks for the advice!
Just looked up some info on the gymnogeos, do the males in this genus get the nuchal hump? I believe I saw a species of these guys at a LFS, but they were labeled Geophagus balzani. Is this just a case of mistaken identity or are the Gymnogeophagus balzani and the Geophagus balzani two different species?
toddnbecka
05-05-2010, 05:03 AM
The proper name is Gymnogeophagus balzanii, there aren't 2 different species. Not too surprising that they would be labeled Geophagus at an lfs though, probably what they're bought under from the distributor.
Here's a link to some pics and info on assorted Gymnogeo's (and other fish) from Uruguay. Looks like the Gymnogenys complex mostly develop a nuchal hump (they're delayed mouthbrooders) while the Rhabdotus complex don't (standard substrate-spawners.)
http://www.aqvaterra.com/cichlids_other_fishes.php
I will be moving along the extra Norte's. I got 8 to make the cost of shipping a bit more worthwhile, but only plan to keep a breeding pair.
My pair of Australoheros oblongum have a new brood of wigglers, but it will be months before they'll be large enough to move along. They're unbelievably mellow for cichlids, get along well with anything that won't beat the snot out of them. The breeding pair will be moved back up to a 75 when the fry are free-swimming. The other residents are 4 red severums, a group of Aulonocara peacocks, 5 Synodontis catfish, and a single silver dollar and fruit tetra.
rothenb1
05-05-2010, 05:17 AM
Thanks so much for that link, it's really informative. There are 4 LFS within 15 miles from me and I've NEVER seen any of these gymnogeos (at least properly labeled ones)! I will definitely look into these guys :)
toddnbecka
05-05-2010, 06:16 AM
I don't buy many fish from my lfs any longer, most are shipped or brought back from road trips to bigger shops. Look around on aquabid for some of the less-common species.
The Gymnogeophagus and Australoheros from Uruguay are relatively new fish in the hobby. One species of Australoheros was actually one of the very first aquarium fish, but it was quickly pushed aside by other species and basically forgotten until recently.
The Australoheros oblongum haven't been imported for several years now; apparently no one can find them in the wild.
Here's a few pics, male first:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/toddnbecka/P1030191.jpg
Female:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/toddnbecka/P1020799.jpg
A couple older pics of the Gymnogeophagus Norte; they're colored up more now, with black edges on the dorsal fin:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/toddnbecka/Basement%20tank/P1040130.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/toddnbecka/Basement%20tank/P1040131.jpg
I posted some pics of the Catalan a while back, they're also looking better now. They look quite similar to a couple of the pics from the link, with lots of red in their fins.
MCHRKiller
05-05-2010, 07:18 AM
My G.abalios came to me in mid-late February at around 3". They are now over 5" if that says anything for their growth rate. Surinamensis sold in LFS are really hit and miss...could be abalios, altifrons or true surinams. Temperment and size are all quite similar so its not really of much better, the only issue with your proposed stock is the restriction of a 4ft long tall aquarium. Geos shoal...the more the merrier, and they are not all that picky about what species they are shoaling with. My abalios and pindare go in one large pack of sand sifting plant destruction. With them I keep 2 5" bossy teenage Rotkeil sevs that shoal with them. I also just picked up a 2" chewed up female GT to finish off the stock once QT and healing are complete.
If you had a 6ft tank I would say bring on the Geos the Severums and even a female GT...female GT introduced to these more peaceful SAs usually work out providing they have ample space. 4ft tanks and robust medium growing cichlids are quite cramped quarters.
I do agree that the smaller Gynogeos for a 90G tank are a better option...get a shoal of atleast 6 you will enjoy them in a pack :11: Also I see nothing wrong with adding in a single blue acara and of course the sevs. Would make a nice 90G, just choose a heavy sand substrate for the geos to sift that is heavy enough to sink so it wont ruin your filtes. Large bodied tetras are also a good filler...Columbians and Buenos Aires make excellent companions IME.
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.