baby melanochromis Auratus? Urgent

[jay2487]

DO all Auratus look the same when they are juvenile? How big until the males turn blue? I am going to pick some up after work and the LFS has 1 inch ones but they are all female coloration. How do I know when I have a male? would egg spots work?

[deathtroll]

All aratus have the female coloration untill the males start to mature.
Egg spots are not a relieable way to sex them as both male and female can have them

I can't rember how big mine were when the males started to change but were a little bigger than that.

the best advice I can give you is to buy the number you want and return, sell, or trade any males you don't want. until you get the number of females you want.

I keep getting juvie males when I get them so I hope you have better luck geting the ones you want.

edit another thing I noticed is look wear the yellow is if it looks faded or white then it is a good chance it['s a male

[jay2487]

I have 4 now and one looks like his black line is smearing like a marker mark on paper you immediately smear with your finger before it dries. I'm hoping it turns male. What is a good ratio of male to female and a good amount for a 110gal?

[deathtroll]

I would go with atleast 4 femals to 1 male.

as fo a number for that size tank I'm not sure. That would depend on the amount of hidding spots and what other fish you have. Basically with theese type of fish you want to be overstocked and keep with other aggreesive mbuna.

[dane]

is that the only species cichlids your having in that tank ?

if so thats awesome

usually you want to have 3 females for every 1 male at least but you could bump up your female numbers

[jay2487]

so, like bettas, two males without a proper number of females spells disaster?

They aren't the only ones in there yet but soon they will be. I have turtles in the tank as well and they are the best surviving fish I've ever kept with turtles. They cannot be touched by a turtle they are so fast and aggressive. So they are beating my feeders up one by one and will soon only have a pleco and a bluegill for company. I also have a blue mbuna and a peacock but my friend wants those and I see the auratus don't care about size because they will ambush them from caves. They are an awesome cichlid though, well so far, I only have juvies, haven't seen a full grown one.

[kaybee]

so, like bettas, two males without a proper number of females spells disaster?

I would say that two full grown sexually mature auratus males wouldn't tolerate each other in the same tank regardless of the number of females.

With hyperdominant mbuna species (of which the m. auratus is one) some males will just not tolerate the presence of another male of their species in the same tank.

[Scrup]

and sometimes with M Auratus they will kill the females if there is less than three. Best to either get 4-5 or be ready to pull him out.

Still be ready to pull him out actually. Mbuna can be unpredictable fish.

[dane]

i have a female auratus its still juvi but will that fish be alot more aggressive than my others mostly zebras cobalt's red's acei etc

[Scrup]

Can't speak for your fish specifically, but i have been successful in keeping a single male auratus in a tank with several other Mbuna, without any out of the normal conflict.I would think the female would be a little more docile than a male.


Another thing to remember, if you keep an auratus in a tank with all the same sexes, they can change sexes. Males into females and females into males. Not terribly common, but it does happen. Actually think that one of the reasons mine is so docile.

[kaybee]

i have a female auratus its still juvi but will that fish be alot more aggressive than my others mostly zebras cobalt's red's acei etc


Generally, as a species, m. auratus are high-end aggressive. Zebra's possess solid high-end aggression potential but in my experience can also be laid back in temperment.

Zebra aggression usually comes to bear when making a run for tank dominance or when their dominance is challenged, or during zebra vs zebra rivalries over breeding rights.

The pecking order in your tank will be formulated by the fish you have (since their ambitions can vary from fish to fish). It's quite possible one of your male zebra's will dominate the female auratus. Another person with the same species stocking as you have may end up with different results.

Acei's a somewhat predispositioned to be at the bottom of the pecking order in a tank containing metriaclima and melanochromis species.

[dane]

o wow thats kinda weird about them changing sex .haha its about a 1.5 inches now not aggressive really at all ill just keep an eye on her to see if she becomes to agressive for my tank

[Scrup]

Like I said, Mbuna can be unpredictable. Mine never bickered at all, then one day, my Acei grew up and terrorized everyone in the tank. M. Auratus, Labs, Red tops, and the powder blue. He was also the smallest at the time, but still chased, nipped, and danced them all into submission.

Except the jewel. No one ever messes with the jewel cichlid more than once..lol

[kaybee]

Another thing to remember, if you keep an auratus in a tank with all the same sexes, they can change sexes. Males into females and females into males. Not terribly common, but it does happen.

Has this phenomenon ever been accurately documented? Change in color patterns can occur (some females can take on the appearance of males in certain situations), but gender change? Have changes in their vents occurred as well? Immature males appear female and I've seen pics of dominant females that have assumed male coloration, but does that constitute genuine gender change?

It would be interesting to test this in a controlled environment (stock a tank full of female auratus that have successfully mouthbrooded fry in the past, and see if pro-creation is possible after that point.

An all-male auratus tank would be quite brutal if trying to test gender male to female gender change. I think a whole-sale massacre would occur before gender change would. Reverting to juvenile ('female') patterns might be a survival technique.

I have some female ps. socolofi (both have produced fry in the past). I lost the male years ago and since then the largest female takes on the male role (they even do mock spawning, with the alpha female always taking on the 'male role'). The socolofi's are they're still female so the eggs never amount to anything (and they're a monomorphic species so she hasn't changed appearance just behavior).

[jay2487]

So if I have one Auratus that seems to have some bleeding of the black stripes, like if you made a line on paper with a marker then smeared it, but the rest have perfect colors then I can about guarantee the smeared darker one is developing into a male?

[deathtroll]

I would not say I would guarantee it. the method I use isn't always accurate and sometimes you will see the same things in fish that have been poorly bred

I hope you have better luck than I have at getting females from juvies I keep getting perfect colored ones that turn out to be males.

[jay2487]

Well the LFS I go to has a 100gal tank well overstocked with 1 inch cichlids for $1.99 a piece, they range from blue to yellow to bright orange to albinos and many others. I got about 5 or 6 auratus out of it and out of them all I have one puny one who seems more white than yellow and one huge one that looks like all his black got smudged onto his yellow and the white has dissappeared. So I tell myself that one way or the other those are probably opposite sexes. But your saying that it could be a dominance thing or poor breeding and they are the same sex? The rest of them have the perfect coloration and a tank beside that one at the LFS has a male which is a little bigger than mine but completely male colored. Do they change colors that quickly that they can completely change without gaining much size? I got a bunch more i need to identify as well Ill get you guys some pics.