Boeseman's Rainbowfish - Question

[Zilla]

I bought 2 juveniles a couple of weeks ago to keep my Turquoise Rainbows company and one of them is a total punk. He doesn't torment the other fish, but he does things that are funny / irritating at the same time.

Last weekend I bought some plants. As I was trying to plant them, he grabbed the roots of the one I was trying to plant and proceeded to play "Tug of War" with me. Later he uprooted it, so I planted somewhere else in hopes he'd leave it alone. Nope, the plant is now leaning on its side because he uprooted it again.

This morning I wanted to check the tank for ammonia levels before I fed the tank. The same Rainbow came up to the top as fast as his little fins would carry him and he bit the test tube.

If I clean the tank, he's the first on to go after whatever I'm using at the moment. The Gold Gourami's he's in with are no help in this department as the three of them huddle around the syphon tube. They can see gravel moving around so they think it's food. If I clean the inside of the glass, my hand gets swarmed by the Gourami's, the bratty Rainbow and the Angelfish.

I've had cichlids do stuff like this, but I've never had a Rainbow behave this way. My Turquoise's go about their business and don't bother with me or anybody else. Is this common behavoir for Boeseman's Rainbows? Should I add a few more? Will he outgrow this obnoxious behavior?

[rich311k]

I would get him some friends, they like groups. I have 5 and they dont do anything like you are describing. Sounds pretty cool.

[Lady Hobbs]

I have 9 and don't see this behavior.

[Northernguy]

A video of that fish would be fun!
I have seen bows chase other fish around but not attack a plant or anything.
Maybe it thinks its an oscar!lol:hmm3grin2orange:

[Zilla]

I don't know what he's thinking. LOL The one Oscar I had a long time ago never acted that way. His thing was to be still in one spot and beg for food. If I had to clean the tank, he'd just move out of the way. Even when I had Convicts years ago, they never acted that way either. They would shred a plant in a matter of seconds, but they never went after other things like a syphon tube or a test tube.

It took forever to decide what to buy as our Jurapari is about 5.5 inches now, so we have to be careful what we add to the tank. To make life more interesting, the fish store we go to only carries juvenile fish for the most part, so we only had a handful to pick from that wouldn't become a snack. He's a grump and becomes even more grumpy at bed time. He spends a good hour chasing everybody out of his corner every night.

Next time we go to the fish store for whatever reason I'll talk to them about it. Since he's not nipping or harassing other fish I'm not worried about it, I just thought it was odd and apparently it is. None of them are starving so it isn't from the lack of food, I think it's just him being a punk.

[annageckos]

The rainbows should be in schools of 6 or more. He sounds like a fun fish. IMO, it seems you have an inquisitive fish. Remember all fish are individuals, I don't think there is anything wrong with him and I wouldn't worry about it or thy to change it. You can alway try putting rocks around the base of the plants to keep him from ripping them up.

[Zilla]

I think I've just been blessed with a tank of goofy fish as the Angelfish has decided to get in on the fun of chasing tubes for water testing as well. I had him zig-zagging all over the tank the other day. LOL

One of these days I'll get a pic of them all crammed to one side of the tank waiting to eat. Every morning I wake up to 7 pairs of eyeballs looking out into the kitchen as they know that's where the food comes from.

[Lady Hobbs]

I have nothing but sympathy for my last remaining female boesemani. She has 7 males to herself and is very, very popular at daybreak. Altho I did not want more, I will have to have more just to give her a break and take some stress from her.

[Zilla]

Everybody keeps telling me that I need to add more, so I did. I added two more and now the ones I had are more obnoxious than before and the 2 newbies have joined in on the freak show.

Along with the new fish I bought yesterday, I also bought some new plants later in the afternoon. The plants were not in the tank for an hour and all 4 of them were determined to either make a salad out of them or rip them out. At one point I had 2 on one side of the plant with the other two on the opposite side and they were playing Tug Of War with a root that just happened to be sticking out. When that didn't work, they started fighting over it. Nobody was injured, but they wouldn't leave it alone until they successfully uprooted the plant which they did.

I'm not adding anymore. People can complain and tell me how they sky is falling because I don't have a big enough group, blah,blah,blah. If they were suffering they wouldn't act this way. They'd be pouting in a corner somewhere or refusing to eat.

The ones at the store don't act any better. I mentioned how the 2 I bought a few weeks ago have been behaving, so the guy we deal with all the time went over and stuck his finger in the tank. What was a somewhat peaceful tank turned into a massive ball of Rainbows without any space between them.

I still don't understand why my Boesemani's are so much different, but I gave up trying to figure it out. After what I witnessed yesterday, it's clearly not something I'm doing, it's just them. Maybe they'll chill out when they get older, maybe they won't. I won't know until they get there...

[The Curious]

I have never kept Rainbows before, but a good friend of mine has, and he had almost the same problem...he was told he needed more bosemani because they were being lil punks to the other tankmates and generally being holy terrors...so he did...he had 3 originally and then added 3 more.

Instead of that chilling the rainbows out it was like adding new members to a nasty street gang.

The 6 of them ended up killing all their tankmates and destroying most of the plants...these guys are pretty as can be, but I wouldn't keep 'em cause they seem to be obnoxious lil squirts.

good luck though mate...sometimes sacrifices have to be made for peace in the tank...just a thought.

I don't know if you are using a LFS or a corporate company, but my LFS lets me bring fish back for full credit, allowing me to test out combinations and find the community that best fits my desires in my tank.
thumbs2: :19: ...again good luck.

Hehe...that Rainbow does sound like he thinks he is an Oscar...hehe

Got any pics??? Or a vid of your crazy group would be fun.

[Cristoff]

Sorry to hear that you are having issues with your Rainbows.

I have 8 Boesemanis in my 90 gal (4 female / 4 male). I have them in there with 8 Dwarf Neon Rainbows, 6 Lemon Tetras, 4 Botia Histrionica Loaches and 2 Bristlenose Plecos. I have NEVER seen any sort of craziness that you are describing, but I don't have live plants in the tank.

I wonder if it's the tankmates that's the problem.

[rich311k]

I have 6 in my 75 gallon. I have no problems with them either. I have never noticed them bothering my plants. I have 2 males and 4 females.

[Zilla]

I have never kept Rainbows before, but a good friend of mine has, and he had almost the same problem...he was told he needed more bosemani because they were being lil punks to the other tankmates and generally being holy terrors...so he did...he had 3 originally and then added 3 more.

Instead of that chilling the rainbows out it was like adding new members to a nasty street gang.

The 6 of them ended up killing all their tankmates and destroying most of the plants...these guys are pretty as can be, but I wouldn't keep 'em cause they seem to be obnoxious lil squirts.

good luck though mate...sometimes sacrifices have to be made for peace in the tank...just a thought.

I don't know if you are using a LFS or a corporate company, but my LFS lets me bring fish back for full credit, allowing me to test out combinations and find the community that best fits my desires in my tank.
thumbs2: :19: ...again good luck.

Hehe...that Rainbow does sound like he thinks he is an Oscar...hehe

Got any pics??? Or a vid of your crazy group would be fun.




My objection to adding more is that having more doesn't always cure the problem. My original plans for my tank was to keep a species tank of Electric Yellows.

At the time, I was hanging out on another fish forum and I had people tell me that I needed to overstock my tank as a means of keeping the peace. Then I was given a list of other fish to keep with the Yellow Labs who in the end, would have shredded the Yellow Labs as all the said fish had issues with other fish of specific colors. That seemed really far fetched so I asked my LFS about it and they confirmed that there are some fish that will do that.

I'm careful about avoiding waving a hand across all Bows and saying that all of them are obnoxious because that is simply not true. I also have Turquoise Bows and they don't bother anything or anybody. I've also had Austrailian Bows and they the meanest little buggers so I got rid of them.

My LFS is a small, family run business. The two chain stores we have don't know their butts from their elbows when it comes to fish, but I still go to them for other things, just not fish as my LFS is over a half and hour away and I can't always make the trip. I tell the people at the said chain stores that I have Rainbows ( they always ask what I'm feeding as I buy frozen food) and they have no clue what I'm talking about.

As for my brats, they haven't shown any aggression towards anything else in the tank. They squabble amongst each other, but it's never serious. They flare at each other and half-heartedly chase each other around, but they did that at the store too. Walk by the tank they were kept in and all of them would put their "I'm a big fish, fear me!" face on. LOL They just have issues with plants for some reason that remains a mystery. This morning I got up, clicked the tank lights on and there was chunks of plant floating at the top.

I know that my Geo didn't do it as he's not a shredder. He'll dig plants up, but he doesn't tear them up. My gourami's didn't do it. They pick amongst the leaves but are harmless. My corys didn't do it and the Turquoise Bows avoid the plants as much as possible. They hang out on the top layer of the tank most of the day unless there is food or if they are being nosy which is often.

The one thing I've observed is that the ankle biters don't bother with plants that have straight or semi-straight leaves. I have two swords that they haven't touched and a plant called a Ribbon plant that they haven't torn into. When I first planted them, they uprooted them but they've since gotten past that. The few other plants I have either have curly leaves or small leaves and they refuse to leave them alone.

I haven't been able to make it down to my LFS and pick their brain about what I've seen and how to deal with it. My whole tank is fed a varied diet so I don't think it's a dietary issue. The other day I plopped some squash in the tank and none of the Bows would go near it. When they found a small piece that was free floating, they spit it out, meanwhile my gourami's loved it. I think they eyes rolled up into the back of their little sweet heads.

I want to add more plants and buy a new light set up, but until I figure out what the shredding thing is all about, those plans have been put onto the back burner. I was told that I could add anubias as they are tougher than other plants, but I have to exercise some restraint for my Geo. He's a eartheater, he needs space to dig around in.

I don't know! Maybe it's a age thing as there are plenty of members here that have Boesemani's a few of which have responded to this thread and they don't have these types of problems. I'm not even sure if my LFS can explain what or why they are doing what they are doing, but I'll ask anyway. I could bring them back and get a credit for them, but they are not doing anything that terrible to justify doing so. If they were outwardly aggressive to everybody else in the tank, I'd bring them back but that's not the case. Yes what they are doing is what I would consider outlandish and a pain in the butt, but it's not enough to warrant their return. I just don't understand and it appears that nobody else does either.

[Northernguy]

Zilla what sex are all your fish.If you have mostly males that may cause the aggression.
I have dwarf rainbows and i find them to be aggressive with certain fish.
I ended up putting them in with white skirt tetras and now they keep to themselves.



I never said you need more!:14: lol

[Zilla]

Zilla what sex are all your fish.If you have mostly males that may cause the aggression.
I have dwarf rainbows and i find them to be aggressive with certain fish.
I ended up putting them in with white skirt tetras and now they keep to themselves.



I never said you need more!:14: lol

I didn't say it was you and even if you had, I don't think it's a bad suggestion, I just don't think it will solve the problem.

I have 2 males / 2 females.

The only aggression I'm seeing is what I described above which IMO, isn't anything really worth noting. If they want to pick at each other, so be it.

[Zilla]

Too soon to say for sure, but I think I've alteast curbed the Dig and Drag plant issue. I can't do anything about shredding, but it's one step at a time I suppose.

I was lurking around here the other day and came across a old thread that talked about plant roots being too short and how to deal with it. I can't remember who it was ( sorry!) but I've put their suggestion to use and didn't have any floating plants this morning.

The suggestion was to cut the bottom of a water bottle of, poke holes in it then plant the "disk" until the plants roots became established. I did it yesterday and so far the plants have been left alone. I don't know how long it will last for, but since I didn't want to use weights that are full of lead, my plants haven't had time to establish a really good roots because they were not being left alone.

Maybe the brats will get bored of messing with the plants if they stay put. (?)

[Zilla]

Plants that are weighted have remained so. Plants that do not have a plastic disk attached to their feet are floating. Gouramis are happy to have something to chew on, the brats are being smug and JJ is all kinds of bent out of shape.

We're going to our LFS today. I'm not buying any fish, but I want some direction regarding what I should do. Do I bother spending lots of money for a light set-up on a tank I very well may not be able to keep and sustain plants in, or do I piece together my empty 20 gallon and have plants in that instead? It should be set up and running anyway as I don't have a QT tank should somebody get sick.

Hubby tried scare tactics with the brats the other day, He kept telling then that we were going to bring home a pirannha if they kept it up. They just looked at him as if to say "Whatever, Dude!" then proceeded to stare out into the kitchen as they know that's where the food comes from.

If only I knew...

[AquaLene]

Strange behaviour you have there... I started off with 4 boesemani's and no plant issues at all? I now have more and still no issues with plants or "brat behaviour". In fact the rainbows love the planted tanks a lot, they thrive in it?

The males do "show off" to each as well as other male rainbows, but they are really chilled-out fish overall, no aggression. In fact the boesies are even more relaxed than some other rainbow species I have (and I got lots). They don't even nibble on plants, never mind uproot them and cause "tank havoc". I weight my plants down with rocks until they're established, maybe try that until the plants are established?

Your "brats" sounds like a little characters though :hmm3grin2orange: Take pics! thumbs2:

[Zilla]

The one person I deal with at my LFS is also stumped. He has kept them in planted tanks in the store and in his own tanks and has never witnessed such behavior either.

He did offer to to take them back and order me a few more Turquoise, but like I said here, they are not being aggressive or disrupting anybody else in the tank. It's just the plants. Other thoughts were to put them in my 20 and allow them to grow up a bit and see what happens. They don't make Bitter Apple for plants to keep fish from chewing on them, so that's out. I suggested we load them up with Valium. LOL I was kidding, sort of.


They're not starving as they are growing and coloring up nicely. Nobody else in the tank is bothering them, tank parameters are fine, ect. I found out that they were wild caught, but that doesn't mean anything as they live amongst lots of vegetation in the wild. It was suggested that maybe they are getting ready to breed, but I don't know if plant shredding is part of their breeding ritual or not. That and the thought of having more than the 4 I already have doesn't impress me much. I groaned at the mere mention of it and was told that it wouldn't be that bad. This coming from a guy who has a fit when the pleco's at the store make a mess out of Romain lettuce which they are fed regularly. LOL

I was just watching them a few minutes ago and they were pulling on the plants I have weighted down with the end of the plastic bottle. They casually go over, give a stem or two a good tug then go about their business. As far as I can tell, there was no food hanging off the leaves who knows.

Hubby is of little help and feels as though that I should just allow the brats to do what they are going to do. I mentioned putting them in the 20 and he rolled his eyes at me. He likes fish tanks, he just doesn't want to deal with them. Now if there was a problem with this XBox that would be completely different. Meh!

I'm just going to anchor what few plants I have and focus on getting stuff for the 20 gallon. It needs just about everything and I need to find a spot for it. Once all is said and done, tank is cycled, blah,blah,blah, then I'll decide on what to do. I've thinking about this for a few weeks and I'm not getting anywhere other than being told that my brats shouldn't be acting like brats or punks which is more like it. Maybe it's just one of those things that shall forever remain a mystery...

[Rhaethe]

The only clue I can think of (maybe) is the fact that they are wild caught. In researching of biotope type aquariums, I've seen where its been suggested (highly advised) that for New Guinea type of biotopes where rainbowfish come from that the planting should be dense at the bottom, some floating vegetation at the top, and the entire middle be left wide open.

Now, the suggestion is, I thought when reading it, more of one for looks, but I did catch one biotope site that said "A tank with large open swimming areas is suggested for rainbowfish."

Maybe they are just rearranging things the way they are accustomed to it being?

[sunfishman]

i wish i had one of them, but only females are left at the lfs, and i want a male because of the bright colors. but if they are like that then i may want to reconsider. was your's in a tank with crack for filter media before you bought him?

[Zilla]

Not to the best of my knowledge.


The only clue I can think of (maybe) is the fact that they are wild caught. In researching of biotope type aquariums, I've seen where its been suggested (highly advised) that for New Guinea type of biotopes where rainbowfish come from that the planting should be dense at the bottom, some floating vegetation at the top, and the entire middle be left wide open.

Now, the suggestion is, I thought when reading it, more of one for looks, but I did catch one biotope site that said "A tank with large open swimming areas is suggested for rainbowfish."

Maybe they are just rearranging things the way they are accustomed to it being?

You may be on to something.

My tank is sparsely planted on the ends as I know they like open water. They don't stay in the top layer like I was told they would, but they do come to the top when they are curious or if there is food around.

I wonder if it's the lack of plants that may be the problem? I can't have a jungle tank as I have a Geo, but I could certainly add more to both sides, the back and perhaps a few java ferns to the front. I don't know how much comfort it would provide as they're not afraid of people or skittish. If somebody stands in front of the tank, they don't care. If somebody puts their hand or face up to the glass, they're usually the first ones to come and see what is going on. When they figure out there is no food, they go off and do their thing until the next person comes along or until there is some type of activity near the tank again.

My LFS has a 70 gallon Bow tank that is planted. * Not the same tank I got mine from* I'm not sure what species of Bows are in it, but there are a few and most of them are adults. Those are in with small prawns, juvie earth eaters, a couple corys and ghost shrimp. For plants there are a few swords, some other plants which I don't know what they are and other plants that look like clumps of wispy grass for lack of a better description. It's not short like dwarf grasses, it's long with very narrow leaves that the prawns like to sit in. Now I wish I asked about it as I can't find anything that even remotely looks like it. Think of a open field with tall wild grasses, only it's inside a tank instead of spreading over a field.

It's not overplanted and very peaceful which is what made me buy Rainbows in the first place. With that said, I've been warned about prawns getting to be over a foot and how they like to dig, but it's still a very quiet tank. I'm not looking to replicate it exactly, but something like it.

I don't mind plant nibbling as I expect them to do that. It's the shredding, yanking, pulling, tugging and plant rough housing that is driving me nuts. Maybe more plants would ward off boredom? Act like a group of zebras where the fish become too confused to pick on one plant because there are too many?

[Rhaethe]

Also maybe increase the filter flow to produce more of a current since they are from a river? Will give them something to play in, other than uprooting the plants, maybe?

[Zilla]

I do that already. Not because of their behavior, but rather to prevent fishy obesity for all although I like to think that I'm one of those that avoids feeding junk food as much as possible. I discovered that the pellets I'm feeding my corys are junk, but that will change this week.

I turn the filters on high for a couple of hours during the day, then slow them down at night so everybody will rest.

[Zilla]

After searching through my fish book, I found the plant ( or one of it's cousins) I that was talking about earlier. It was driving me crazy not having atleast a name. It's a hair grass... http://www.aqua-fish.net/show.php?what=plant&cur_lang=2&id=85

In my book, the leaves on these plants are not as thick as they are pictured on the site above. The leaves look like thick hair. The picture from the site looks like lavender.

[Rhaethe]

That's the only plant they uproot?

[Zilla]

I don't have any. The hairgrass is what is in the planted tank at my LFS.

The only plant in my tank they don't bother with is my sword. It has well developed roots and they don't bother with chewing on it for whatever reason.

[Zilla]

I should just start a journal about this, but I'm too lazy...

I put in a plant order. I paid for second day air, so they should be here no later than Thursday.

I already have Ludwigia which has been taking a beating, but it has new leaves, so I'll leave it. I also have some type of Sword and some other thing that I have no idea what it is. It started out looking like a small shrub and now it's a very thin shrub. I did have Water Sprite, but it was destroyed so I took it out and pitched it.

I ordered:

Vals, Jungle (Vallisneria gigantea)
Java Fern (Microsorium pteropus)
Pennywort, Brazilian (Hydrocotyle Leucocephala)
Giant Hairgrass (Eleocharis montevidensis)
Java Moss (Vesicularia Dubyana)
Fert Tabs- I didn't have any

Vals and Pennywort are for cover although the Pennywort won't do much. I ordered it more for me than them.

Java Fern- Just because I didn't want to order more swords.

Java Moss- My gut is telling me that they'll leave it alone although I've read that they like to breed in "moss mops". I didn't order it for that reason, but we'll see.

I don't know if the Giant Hairgrass will work in my tank or not. If I recall, the lighting over my LFS's planted Bows tank isn't anything special, so we'll see. It will be the sacraficial lamb out of the bunch if the rest survive.

Tonight I'll buy more gravel so the plants can't readily be dug up or pulled up and the Fish Gum Drops from Pet Co need to go. The Xanthan Gum is funking up the water although water parameters are fine. And I need to find something to attach the moss to.

If this doesn't work, I give up.

[Zilla]

Tank is planted.

One would have thought the world was coming to a end by the way the brats paled out on me as I was taking stuff out. They weren't pale for long as once they figured out that their world wasn't going anywhere, the biting of the plants started. Vals- Bite! Pennywort- Bite! Java Ferns- Bite! They even went after my sickly looking Java Moss that I recieved. The only thing they didn't bother to taste was the Giant Hairgrass. It could be where it's planted, or maybe it tastes bad. Odds are I'll never know.

My Gouramis are loving their new digs. The male spent his time chewing on my arm as I was trying to get stuff done. The females would make their over to see what he was doing, but found the plants more interesting which was fine by me.

I added a inch of gravel for a total of 3", so only time will tell if I need to come up with another way to keep the plants rooted. So far so good, but things always seem to happen during the night. At some point last night they yanked up the oddball plant that I didn't know the name off and chewed all the roots off. I wasn't attached to it, so I pulled it out this morning and pitched it.

Just another day with the freaks. I'll post a pic of the tank in the photo section later in the week or next week. I rinsed the gravel, but the tank is still hazy from dust.

[Zilla]

I'm done! I'm sick of having to clean out my filter intakes everyday and now they're going after the Pennywort. It isn't bad enough the punks have to rip apart the Java Moss and the Vals, oh no. Now they're going after the Pennywort as well. See the bottom? That didn't look like that yesterday and the plants didn't come with chewed leaves.

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa192/Zillasplace/chewed.jpg

Plants are being moved to the 20 gallon, assuming there is anything left by the weekend. I know there will be, but how many of the plants won't have chunks missing out of them is the question.

I don't have fish, I have a herd billy goats. Turds...

[Rhaethe]

I don't have fish, I have a herd billy goats. Turds...

My fish and your fish must carry the same genetic code.

[Zilla]

The brats are not happy with me since I took away their means of grazing. They went all pale on me yesterday when I took the Vals and Pennywort out which upon further inspection had been seriously abused. One plant is half the size it was originally a week ago.

They're not sick and their water parameters are fine, so I say let them be pale and pouty. I left them the plants they have been leaving alone, so they can suck it up and deal with it. I'll rearrange some things and put the taller plastic plants back in when I do a water change.