Perruno Catfish Update.

[kaimarkhirst]

Well Members,

For those who dont know, I recently aqquired an extremely rare 2ft 15 year old perruno catfish and atiger shovelnose. The shovelnose shipped perfectly, however the perruno (Understandably) was in an extremely bad way, his whiskers were practically non existant, he had open sores and wounds from fin to mouth from the travel down and was not expected to survive at all beyond 1 week or so....

Well an update for you is good....

His wounds are healing thanks to an extreme amount of vigilance, care and attention from me, his whiskers are back, not fully grown, but enough to navigate and find the fresh salmon food for them and I had a confirmed visual case of him eating!!!!! (Fantasticly good sign this..)

Another good sign is, as expected, some smaller catfish (I say smaller, but a fully grown pictus is not small at all!!!) are "missing" So his instincts and reflexes are there to hunt. So all in all, a fantastic recovery is in progress.

Well happy.....

Will get some more pics up of him soon..

Kai

[Red]

What size tank is he in? I would be doing water changes every two days or so. Can't wait for pics, not that familiar with this type of catfish.

[kaimarkhirst]

currently hes in the 150g long...

Changing water twice per week will actually stress a fish this old out due to tamp changes and such...

Water changes are done 10% per week with RO water only to keep the chemical balance right and, with the FX5 on max, and 2500 litres of oxygen p/h pumped into the tank, its a lovely recovery habitat and hes very happy indeed...

Will be looking to move him to his permanent home in februray when his weight is regulated (Actually overweight!!), wounds are fully healed and scales are present, his wiskers are fully grown (Catfish this size and age are mostly blind, and in a 14 foot tank hes going in, hell likely starve without a full set of whiskers which in this case, are around 6 inches long and 3 inches on his bottom lip.) and im happy with water conditions in the 14 footer...

[Red]

currently hes in the 150g long...

Changing water twice per week will actually stress a fish this old out due to tamp changes and such...

Water changes are done 10% per week with RO water only to keep the chemical balance right and, with the FX5 on max, and 2500 litres of oxygen p/h pumped into the tank, its a lovely recovery habitat and hes very happy indeed...

Will be looking to move him to his permanent home in februray when his weight is regulated (Actually overweight!!), wounds are fully healed and scales are present, his wiskers are fully grown (Catfish this size and age are mostly blind, and in a 14 foot tank hes going in, hell likely starve without a full set of whiskers which in this case, are around 6 inches long and 3 inches on his bottom lip.) and im happy with water conditions in the 14 footer...

:rolling: I would love to see the proof in that.
Good luck, which all I have to say.

[robflanker]

Changing water twice per week will actually stress a fish this old out due to tamp changes and such...

Yeah not sure about the statement.

Thats the joy of thermometers. You can use them to manipulate the water temperature when you are adding it to the tank.

Also, WCs are used to initiate breeding habits often (corys for example) - so im not sure theyd be breeding if they were stressed.

As Red said, id love to see any credible information you have on this topic regarding WC = bad

[kaimarkhirst]

Ok to clarify.

WAter changes in general are imperetive to a constantly healthy tank, im not argugint with that. Im also not arguing with the fact that water changes are imperetive to a recovering fish.

What I am saying is this.

A fish this old needs very little interference at all.

The filtration system ive got on this tank is doing the work for me, if the interaction of new water is introduced, it can chemically change the composition of the tank and have an affect on the overall recovery process. Thermometers only pick up gradual changes to the water makeup, not immediate so the amount of water you add, can change the temp regardless of what your thermometer says, this will only give you an accurate reading about 25-30 mins after circulation.

So im not saying that water changes are bad, im saying in this instance that water changes are not nessecary in this instance concerning this fish.

Hope this clears it up,

Kai

[robflanker]

I'm pretty sure thermometers work better than 25-30 minutes in terms of their responsiveness. Its not accurate to a second by second basis. But its better than that. *edit - the ones we use that is, i know there really good ones out there*

You filtration does not remove nitrates from the water unless you have a magical filtration system. If so, I would like the brand cos I want one immediately.

A sick fish always needs WCs - i've yet to read anything anywhere that encourages a sit and let it be attitude.

[Red]

You still have something your missing. Doing water changes do not only improve water quality, but have nutrients in the water that can improve the healing of the catfish. When you don't change the water in the tank, the same old used up water has nothing to add for the fish, which the fish needs to reproduce there slime coat. Its a silly statement that the fish is too old to have water changes, because they do need it. Enough said.

[Crispy]

Water changes are a must. 15 years old is not an extremely old catfish (big cats can live a long long time). Twice a week 30% wcs is the best medicine.

[KingFisher]

Water changes are a must. 15 years old is not an extremely old catfish (big cats can live a long long time). Twice a week 30% wcs is the best medicine.



I agree. The stress from poor water quality will negatively effect the fish much more than the stress from waterchanges would.

[Tetris]

You filtration does not remove nitrates from the water unless you have a magical filtration system. If so, I would like the brand cos I want one immediately.

Exactly... A filter doesn't actually make the water pure of toxic substance, it just converts one toxic substance into a less toxic substance. Either way you still have a toxic substance building up. One just requires a higher concentration to harm fish than the other.

[kaimarkhirst]

fact. Unless you have direct access to the exact (or similar) water the fish is or was residing at, youll never recreate the positive healing conditions that is neede to a perfect natural recovery.

If you (As ive done.,..) recreate the synthetic properties of the natural habitat of the general aquatic world (Pete, aquatic rock, decayable substances, Ie, a full bio-habitat) in your filtration system ,and you multiply that at least 3-4 times that of your size of your aquarium, then youll more or less have a good start of creating a natural bio-habitat..

Obviously youll have to replenish these ingredients to maintain the system, but I generally dont believe in changing the water to a certain extent (Obviously changing a certain amount of water is needed), I believe in changing the bacteria populated media, as I belive that his deteriorates.

Water itself does not deteriorate (micro-nutrients do), the replenishing or filtering quality does however....

[Tetris]

So let me get this straight... You've got a bunch of filters (or a sump) and you filled it with rocks, peat moss, and decaying biomatter... And you think this is filtering your water?

It doesn't matter how much filtration you stick on an aquarium... 1 filter will accumulate nitrates in the water just as fast as 25 will... If 1 filter is effectively converting the ammonia to nitrites, and nitrites to nitrates, adding more filtration wont make any difference, because they will never remove those nitrates, and those nitrates are toxic. This is why we do water changes... To remove nitrates... Because our filters can't... No filter can. Especially not one based on rocks and decaying substances. Plants can, but you'd need a tons and tons of fast growing plants for it to be effective. It has nothing to do with deteriorating water and everything to do with the build up of toxins inside an enclosed environment.

[Red]

Agreed, tetris hit it on the head. Everybody does waterchanges over 25% once a week, even more.

[Lab_Rat]

fact. Unless you have direct access to the exact (or similar) water the fish is or was residing at, youll never recreate the positive healing conditions that is neede to a perfect natural recovery.

If you (As ive done.,..) recreate the synthetic properties of the natural habitat of the general aquatic world (Pete, aquatic rock, decayable substances, Ie, a full bio-habitat) in your filtration system ,and you multiply that at least 3-4 times that of your size of your aquarium, then youll more or less have a good start of creating a natural bio-habitat..

Obviously youll have to replenish these ingredients to maintain the system, but I generally dont believe in changing the water to a certain extent (Obviously changing a certain amount of water is needed), I believe in changing the bacteria populated media, as I belive that his deteriorates.

Water itself does not deteriorate (micro-nutrients do), the replenishing or filtering quality does however....

Water does not deteriorate, but it does get loaded with organic breakdown products such as nitrate. The way nitrate is removed is via water changes. Water changes are critical for healing and the health of the fish, as long as the new water is similar to the old water (temperature, etc) it is not stressful for the fish. You have things backwards. Media lasts a long time.

[Crispy]

You filtration does not remove nitrates from the water unless you have a magical filtration system. If so, I would like the brand cos I want one immediately.

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This stuff works great rob... :) It can be done.