PH lower than Low

[speedie]

I have a 90 gallon tank with live plants. I restarted it from an established tank gone bad about 2 months ago. My levels were all great until recently. Amonia and Nitrates are 0. My PH is less than 6 (unreadable). Established fish are fine, new fish mostly died. Changing water weekly, about 25%. Added PH up 3 times as per instructions. Water is going cloudy. Filter components all changed about 2 weeks ago.

What should I do?

L

[Northernguy]

Welcome to the Fabulous AC!
Do a water change!
Test your ph from the tap.
What kind of test kit are you using?
Some crushed coral added to your substrate will stabalize your ph.You may want to add it slowly so you do not increase it too much too fast.Use a bag to measure it out first.

[speedie]

I addded some shells from Lake Eerie. My tap water is almost 8 for ph. I changed my water Monday and again today. Does low ph really matter except for when you add new fish?:11:

[Northernguy]

Stable ph is what matters.That is a drastic difference between the two.
The crushed coral will get your ph to a stable higher level.So does Limestone or tafu stone.Its available at most chain stores.
I would shoot for closer to 7.
Drip acclimating your fish will also help your new fish through the change.

[speedie]

So dummy me... curshed coral right in my gravel? how much for my tank size? Does it also stabilize at some point? What about the buffering....do you think its affecting things?

[rich311k]

Yes the PH will stabilize with crushed coral in the tank. Put a handful in a mesh bag in your filter and see what it does. you can always add more if you need it. The cc will be the buffer. That is what effects the PH and determines how stable the PH will be. Water with no buffer will have a PH that bounces like crazy.

[speedie]

That sounds great. Look out fish store, here I come for some CC (and not Canadian Club, but if my fancy angel dies, I will NEED some of that!)

[Crispy]

Lake Erie shells will do nothing. Test your tap water. Is it the same ph as your tank? It should be very close. If yes, then add some crushed coral. If no, then something in your tank is driving the ph down.

[MCHRKiller]

Noticed that you stated that you have live plants, are you running CO2? If so that could be what is driving down your pH....also having a very low KH level will let your pH flunctuate that much. Raising your KH should help your pH come back up and stabilize.

[speedie]

:fish: Ok, so I tried getting crushed coral and my little town doesn't have it. In the meantime, my fish are dying (my little orange pleco who was one of the first fish we got "pumpkin" and both my black mollies and all 4 of my tuxedo guppies) My water is greenish and cloudy. Amonia and Nitrates are still zero. PH is still lower than 6. I am getting very frustrated and really don't want to loose my fancy angel!

HELP!
:help: :help:

[Lab_Rat]

The bouncing pH is probably what is stressing the fish. Did you ever figure out what was causing the drop? You need to figure that out. Epsom salts will help harden the water if that is what you want to do and baking soda will raise pH. You do need to be careful with these and don't change the pH and hardness too fast.

[toddnbecka]

I can send you a some crushed coral for the cost of shipping. A handful, either in a filter or on top of your gravel, will do the job. Alternatively, you could use baking soda to your tap water when you do partials. It won't raise the pH much higher than 8 regardless of how much you use, but it will raise the kh, which is what keeps the pH stable.

[speedie]

I will try the baking soda. I have been doing partial water changes, like 20% every few days but the PH is still low. I water is green/cloudy. Almost like it is cycling anew. I shut the lights off for a few days and it helped a bit, but still ongoing. No more fish have died (yet) and IF my pearl angel dies, I will cry. Her name is Isis:1luvu: .

Any idea how much baking soda I should try for a 90 gallon tank?
Are cichlids easier?

Lisa

[toddnbecka]

How long has the tank been set up? You mentioned that it had been restarted; was it an older setup to begin with? Over time, debris accumulating in the substrate and decaying will lower the pH, something known as "old tank syndrome". Adding baking soda will eventually neutralize the organic acids that are lowereing the pH, then raise and stabilize it. Until the critical point is passed the pH will keep dropping as the acid overpowers the baking soda. I'd use 1 Tbsp/5 gallons of water (actual volume, allowing for displacement from gravel, etc.) daily until the pH is stabilized, then continue to use that amount when you do partials to help maintain it.

[Sarkazmo]

There's something VERY wrong here! There's no way your PH should be dropping from 8 at the tap to less than 6 in the tank! Unless you're running a huge amount of CO2 in addition to a ton of peat in the tank and a pile of driftwood! In fact I'd say your tank to close to the point where your plants will start melting from the carbonic acid if you're using CO2. There's something in that tank that's either severely affecting PH or for some reason your testing kit or the way you're testing is affecting the results. I hope you're not using your fingers to stopper the vials when you're testing because that'll throw the test way off.

Sark

[speedie]

Not sure what it means to "run CO2" so I am going to say that I am not. The tank was established about 6 years ago, then last year my 3 year old fed the tank an entire canister of food... the rest was disaster! So, I cleaned the entire tank on the inside, and left the filter. I established the tank about 5 months ago, with 5 of the orginal plants and 6 fish. Cycled well. No drift wood. Been adding a couple of fish a month, until recently. Last month, I changed everything in the filter except the corky like things (bio balls or something). Thats probably the start of the issues.

PH is still 6. Changing water every 3 days, about 20%. Not using fingers to test. Tap water still tests 8. Added PH up a few times, but again concerned about stressing fish. Today, added baking soda, but didn't know how much to add, so basically just a sprinkle. I will add more.

Thanks so much for all the advice.

p.s. I am worried about doing to much at a time, so should I still add the crushed coral?

:11: tanks! Lisa

[speedie]

I used to have a large hunk of amethyst in my aquarium (properly washed and all that) and started having problems when I took it out...coincidence probably. Also, just check my nitrates and amonia and again, they are neutral. :ssmile:

[Sarkazmo]

Amethyst is usually encased in Calcite, calcium... would make your tank more alkaline. I looked into this some time ago as I wanted to put in an Amethyst cathedral geode chunk in a 135 gallon tank as a center piece.

If it's just the bare gem with no encasing rock then it should be close to inert so it wouldn't effect water chemistry.

I'd add the crushed coral. Take an old pair of hose/stocking (nylon) and make a sachet of crushed coral that'll fit in your filter(s). That should help change the chemistry. You should rinse the crushed coral very well before putting it in the filter. You'll still probably have some haziness to the water but it will clear, it just may take a day or so.

Sark

[speedie]

Why is crushed coral so difficult to get!?!?! And why is my water so cloudy? Any ideas what is causing the ph to drop? None of those other things apply like driftwood or CO2 or peat moss.
:goldfish: :fish:

[Lab_Rat]

If you have a Petsmart or Petco by you they should carry crushed coral. It's not really a specialty item.

[speedie]

It must be cycling again from changing so much in the filters. But I hate it. Levels are fine, except the ongoing saga of low PH. Crushed coral appears to be a hard find, not even Petsmart had it unless I wanted to buy a 5 pound bag of it! However, fish seem ok... getting a little aggressive. My "invisible" clown loaches have become bullies, my princess pearl Angel is the largest fish in the tank and letting everyone know it, and my newbies lemon tetras are victims to the loaches! I only have one tank! Why can't everyone just get along! lol:14:
Lisa

[Lab_Rat]

Crushed coral only comes in large bags. IIRC, mine was a 50# bag, so if you can find 5# you're lucky.

[speedie]

I would love some crushed coral... could you send it COD? Private message me for address if you are willing. Thanks so much.

[Lab_Rat]

Sorry, all of my crushed coral is being used as substrate in my shellie tank. Don't have any left.