10 Gallon at the Office

[Lolita]

Hi all

So since I set up my 29 gallon (I'm cycling now, waiting to put fishies in!) my father has been getting really excited for the fish, and he keeps asking me when I get to put the fish in.

He's always wanted to do a huge aquarium downstairs somewhere, but my mother HATES fish, so he can't. Well, my father and I share an office (I work for him) and at the moment, we're between offices and in a temporary area for a few months. It's a tiny office, but I thought I could set my old 10 gallon tank up in the office so he can enjoy some fish as well. Of course he wants to put angels and stuff in it...but that's why he's not allowed to touch it, just look at it and smile...

I'm thinking of doing either a divided betta tank, a betta with a small school of tetra, or a moderate school of tetra (maybe neons or something a little more hardy, like glowlights). It will probably be lightly planted (with some anubias, and maybe some kind of soft grass.)

Would the tank be okay if kept on a timer in an office? We're only here 9-5 Monday through Friday (though I stay a few times a week till 10 or 11, since I rent a studio in the same building.) and I want to make sure the tank will be okay left unattended 2 days a week.

(blush) I ask too many questions.

[Northernguy]

Why divide it?
You can easily do a nice school of cardinals or neons with a betta.It has worked out fine in my ten for over a year.Not one death by betta.
I have had the usual difficulty finding healthy neons.
All the fish are real happy in that tank.I even added an apple snail.Its a happy tank! lol
I have left the tanks for up to 5 days with no probs.

[lmgiles88]

I assumed when she said divided Betta tank, she meant two bettas?

[Neon]

I have Betta with neons and they are fully compatible ...and yes I think you can leave them for 2 days..I use a timer for the lights...fasting for a couple of days won't make any harm to them...

[Lolita]

Lol Yes, I meant two bettas.

Though I my first choice is a betta with a smalls chool of tetras! I have everything I need to set the tank up already, but I wanted to make sure it would be okay to leave it two days a week.

I also have a problem with hard water. The water in this building is TERRIBLE. I have to use poland springs water in my iron in the studio or else I get calcium build-ups every where.

What should I do about water changes? Will it be okay to use this water as long as I use dechlor and leave it in buckets for a few hours before doing the change? Or should I use water form another source?

[Lab_Rat]

For your water question, it depends on the fish. If they're used to your local water then they will likely be ok. That being said, I'd avoid fish that tend to be wild caught (cardinals, sometimes neons) as they are not as likely to adjust as easily. I have very hard water (liquid rock) and my fish have done fine with it, but they were in the same city water at the LFS.

Maybe do a betta with some platies since platies like hard water.

[Lolita]

For your water question, it depends on the fish. If they're used to your local water then they will likely be ok. That being said, I'd avoid fish that tend to be wild caught (cardinals, sometimes neons) as they are not as likely to adjust as easily. I have very hard water (liquid rock) and my fish have done fine with it, but they were in the same city water at the LFS.

Maybe do a betta with some platies since platies like hard water.

Ooh, thank you. I never even thought of platies. How many would be comfortable in a ten gallon along with a single betta? I like the blue platies, they're beautiful!

Edit: Though come to think of it, the Betta really isn't a requirement. With fish like platies I probably wouldn't even need a centerpiece fish.

[Northernguy]

I wouldn't go with livebearers in such a small tank unless you have another place for all the fry!
Thats why I like tetras.They are hard to breed and you never have to worry about a million fry!They also stay near the bottom to mid tank.Live bearers are always up near the surface in the bettas territory.
The choice is yours though! lol

[Lab_Rat]

With platies I'd do 1m/3f, plus the betta for fry control. Other options would be an all male guppy tank, a tetra tank (like 6 black skirt tetras or 6 serpae), rasboras, or danios.

[Lolita]

I wouldn't go with livebearers in such a small tank unless you have another place for all the fry!
Thats why I like tetras.They are hard to breed and you never have to worry about a million fry!They also stay near the bottom to mid tank.Live bearers are always up near the surface in the bettas territory.
The choice is yours though! lol

That's a good point. I'm not looking to breed at all, and my father wants this to be a low-maintenance show tank.

I do like the look of the cardinal tetra--I'm just worried about water hardness. I think they sell calcium remover tablets for aquariums though, right?

[Wild Turkey]

Your only issue with ph and cardinals or any of the common tank breds mentioned will be stability overall. As long as the ph is stable you're okay. You wont need or want to mess with your buffer. If you are really worried about it start by testing and giving us your ph and hardness (gh and kh)

[HeatherB]

If you were to drip acclimate your fish, very slowly, they would probebly adjust OK to harder water, esp if you get your fish from a store that is very near the building, as they more than likely have hard water too. If you did have a problem, at least the tank isn't like 100 gallons! 10 gallons of water would be doable to transport. I always had a betta with platies and never a problem, I always added the betta last though.

[Lab_Rat]

Cardinals are one that I would avoid with hard water, unless you're going to go with ro/di water. If you like livebearers you could get all males so you don't have to worry about fry. I just wouldn't do all male guppies with a betta as you may have problems (male guppies trying to breed with the betta). I've got a male betta in with 1m/3f guppies and haven't had any problems, nor any fry, since the betta eats the fry as soon as they pop out. That's why I said a betta for fry control. Dwarf gourami would also fit into that role well.

[Lab_Rat]

Your only issue with ph and cardinals or any of common tank breds is going to be stability overall. You wont need or want to mess with your buffer. If you are really worried about it start by testing and giving us your ph and hardness (gh and kh)

Turk, as far as I know, most cardinals are still wild caught since they are so difficult to breed domestically and they provide great income for the people who catch them without devastating the wild populations.

[Lolita]

Your only issue with ph and cardinals or any of common tank breds is going to be stability overall. You wont need or want to mess with your buffer. If you are really worried about it start by testing and giving us your ph and hardness (gh and kh)

Okay. I'll get a sample of the water and take it to get it tested today. At home I don't have this problem since we have our own well, but this office has terrible water, and I know that using bottled water is a bad idea.

[Girl Got Mojo]

You could also do all female or all male for the platies. Tho i would do all male
because females might be holding or pregnant already.

[Wild Turkey]

Turk, as far as I know, most cardinals are still wild caught since they are so difficult to breed domestically and they provide great income for the people who catch them without devastating the wild populations.

Just like any fish, it has to come into popularity before there will be an interest in mass breeding, but cardinal is there imo. Lots of people breed these now
My local petsmart says theirs are tank bred. I assume petco's are because they couldnt keep a wild fish to save their own lives XD

Aquabid would be the place to go to get wild caught ones im sure, but even then its hard to say they wouldnt be fine since the OP hasnt given their parameters

[Lolita]

I don't have a test kit here with me now, it's at home--and my kit doesn't test for hardness, so I'll have to either pick up another test kit, or take a sample someplace on my way home from work this evening to get it tested for me. I should know by tomorrow what my parameters are.

[Wild Turkey]

I don't have a test kit here with me now, it's at home--and my kit doesn't test for hardness, so I'll have to either pick up another test kit, or take a sample someplace on my way home from work this evening to get it tested for me. I should know by tomorrow what my parameters are.

If your LFS uses strip tests tell them not to bother, theyre hardly accurate enough to be called a "test"

If they use liquid tests (test tubes) then thats a great way to save yourself some $ API FW master test and combination hardness test is gonna run you around 30-35$ but will give you everything you are gonna need

Ammonia
Nitrite
Nitrate
GH
KH
PH
High PH

I can get the links for you if you need them

[Lolita]

Ooh you know what? I might be a liar. I think the test kit I have at home does test for water hardness! I'm going to call home and see if someone's there to check for me lol.

[Lolita]

Yay it does!

This is the test kit I have:

[Only Registered Users Can See Links.]

[Wild Turkey]

Yay it does!

This is the test kit I have:

[Only Registered Users Can See Links.]

Yup, thats excellent as long as they arent expired all you need is nitrate which is about 6$

[Lolita]

Yup, thats excellent as long as they arent expired all you need is nitrate which is about 6$

xD Oh no.. I hope they aren't expired. I'll have to check that. I bought it a year ago...

[Wild Turkey]

xD Oh no.. I hope they aren't expired. I'll have to check that. I bought it a year ago...

They are usually good for about 1 year, you could try them and use a friends or the lfs test and compare

[Lolita]

They are usually good for about 1 year, you could try them and use a friends or the lfs test and compare

Okay!

I know my well water parameters, so I can do a test on that first and if it comes out okay, I'll be pretty confident that it's still in working condition. If not I'll just have to buck up and buy a new kit lol.

[terrapin24h]

In my 10 at work i have 1 gold gourami and 2 apple snails. The gourami is a mean bugger and doesn't like company. The only reason the snails last is their armor. However, he is a very interactive fish with people. He sticks out his feelers, flares, splashes. Everyone here loves him. It's a nice low maint tank. I give it water changes every week or so and things just hum. One of the things i thought about when setting up a work tank was the maint level. For a tank at work you really want something that requires as little maint as possible. Just .02

--chris

[vegas2k]

They are usually good for about 1 year, you could try them and use a friends or the lfs test and compare


directly from API :

The last four digits are the month and year of manufacture. Example: Lot # 28A0108. This is a pH reagent manufactured in January of 2008. Wide Range pH, High Range pH, Ammonia, Nitrate, Phosphate, Copper, Calcium and GH all last for three years. Nitrite and KH will last for four years. Freshwater pH (low range) and Pond Care Salt Level will last for five years. I would not use or trust these kits after they have expired.



So you have 3 years for Wide Range pH, High Range pH, Ammonia, Nitrate, Phosphate, Copper, Calcium and GH

4 years for Nitrite and KH.

[Lolita]

directly from API :



So you have 3 years for Wide Range pH, High Range pH, Ammonia, Nitrate, Phosphate, Copper, Calcium and GH

4 years for Nitrite and KH.

Oh fantastic! Thank you so much =D

[vegas2k]

np! Good luck with your 10g!

[Lolita]

np! Good luck with your 10g!

=D Thanks! If the water testing goes well I may set it up tomorrow and start cycling lol.

[Wild Turkey]

directly from API :



So you have 3 years for Wide Range pH, High Range pH, Ammonia, Nitrate, Phosphate, Copper, Calcium and GH

4 years for Nitrite and KH.

Yup, that is what I would say about a product I sell as well. The 1 year quip is from experience, not the company that sells the tests. Another reason its important to make sure your old tests are still good, is test kits often sit on the shelf for their entire shelf life before being bought.

That is the exact response you will receive from api if you email them any test kit related question

Its like saying "the lfs told me a 10 gallon was good for my goldfish, so it is" .. I very rarely take advice from people who stand to make money off my failures.

heres a quote from a user that works in a LFS

What is the batch number on the ammonia test regents. The last number indicates a year. The test kit is good 2 years from that point. We have occassionaly recieved rtest kits with expired regents in them. You never know you might have an expired batch. Also ensure you are using the freshwater comparison strip and not the salt water.

[vegas2k]

the thing is, correct me if my logic seems off...if they want to make more money they would tell you it expires earlier, and then make more money from you buying a new kit, right? Anyhow, I just checked my kit i just got, and they are a mix between Feb-May of this year. So theyre overall about 7 months old. i do hope to be using this kit until about 2012 :)

[Wild Turkey]

the thing is, correct me if my logic seems off...if they want to make more money they would tell you it expires earlier, and then make more money from you buying a new kit, right? Anyhow, I just checked my kit i just got, and they are a mix between Feb-May of this year. So theyre overall about 7 months old. i do hope to be using this kit until about 2012 :)

Totally logical, however if I advertise the fact that my test kits can be bought expired, or expire quickly you wont buy my test kits in the first place, so replacing them and the costs involved dont really apply in that case.

IMO the fact that you have to go online to find out when your test kits expire is ridiculous and endangers our pets. The expiration should be printed on the bottle, just like a consumable. We can dream.. lol

[Lab_Rat]

I'm not really understanding your logic either Turk. If they said they expire sooner than they actually do then they'd make more money but if they say they're good longer then you don't buy as many.

A company cannot lie about expiration dates, they would have QC people all over them. Not to mention whatever regulatory boards the test kits fall under.

[vegas2k]

regardless of the case, I do agree with Turk that they should have the actual expiration date..so no confusion then.

[sheamurai]

I have a ten gallon at work (I am now wondering how many of us sneak a tank onto our desks at work) 1m and 2 female guppies, and a dwarf gourami, and 2 cardinal tetras. the gourami is great at fry control. the tetras were an accident - I was using that tank as a QT tank but the tetras seemed to do so well there that I just left them rather than take them home to add to my school in the main tank. *BEWARE* tho - I used to wonder why my tank was always so dirty - well, everyone that came by was feeding my fish! No wonder they were getting chubby...they'd get fed by 4 or 5 people per day!

[Northernguy]

Lolita if you have a tank thats cycled at home just grab a bit of media and place it in your new tank filter once you set it up.That way you can safely add fish right away! Start with the cardinals if you like and get the betta after a week or two. Adding the media will instantly cycle your tank!
If the lfs is close to your office than its likely that your water supply is the same.Your water may test almost identical.

sheamurai hide your food at work! lol

[HeatherB]

Everyone at my work was leaving the lights on, like all the time, all night/weekend etc. I could NOT figure out why I had so much algae and that was why!

Maybe put a little dish out of food (like, daily instead of you feeding the fish, put it on the plate and 'teach' people to get the food from the plate and give it to the fish. That way you are still in control of what and how much is given, but all your coworkers get to play with the fish too !

[Padams]

Would the tank be okay if kept on a timer in an office? We're only here 9-5 Monday through Friday (though I stay a few times a week till 10 or 11, since I rent a studio in the same building.) and I want to make sure the tank will be okay left unattended 2 days a week.


I do not see what you are planning to do with the filtration in your absence. I will presume it will be 24/7 correct?

I would get 6-8 Zebras (Danios)
Hardy, Active, Active, Active though y'all may not spend as much time working as you should.:ssuprised:

[Deleted User]

I think you and your dad would enjoy an office aquarium!!!

I've been business partners with my dad since 1994 :) Now, I'm the president of our corporation thumbs2:

[Lolita]

I have a ten gallon at work (I am now wondering how many of us sneak a tank onto our desks at work) 1m and 2 female guppies, and a dwarf gourami, and 2 cardinal tetras. the gourami is great at fry control. the tetras were an accident - I was using that tank as a QT tank but the tetras seemed to do so well there that I just left them rather than take them home to add to my school in the main tank. *BEWARE* tho - I used to wonder why my tank was always so dirty - well, everyone that came by was feeding my fish! No wonder they were getting chubby...they'd get fed by 4 or 5 people per day!

LOL Well that won't be a problem here. It's going to be in mine and dad's office, and no one comes in here except us. Plus the food is going to be kept in my desk, so I'll be the only one feeding them, unless Dad decides he wants to learn how.

[Lolita]

Lolita if you have a tank thats cycled at home just grab a bit of media and place it in your new tank filter once you set it up.That way you can safely add fish right away! Start with the cardinals if you like and get the betta after a week or two. Adding the media will instantly cycle your tank!
If the lfs is close to your office than its likely that your water supply is the same.Your water may test almost identical.

sheamurai hide your food at work! lol

I would love to just instantly cycle my tank, but unfortunately the tank I have at home is still cycling. I don't mind cycling the tank here, though--I'll be doing both at the same time, so it'll be kind of interestin to see the differences between the two, if there are any lol!

But the LFS is in a different town, so their water is from a different source. However I did find water softeners so I'll give them a try and see if it makes a difference!

[Lolita]

I do not see what you are planning to do with the filtration in your absence. I will presume it will be 24/7 correct?

I would get 6-8 Zebras (Danios)
Hardy, Active, Active, Active though y'all may not spend as much time working as you should.:ssuprised:

Oh yes, it'll be 24/7 filtration and heating! The light is the only thing that will be on a timer.

I'm definately considering danios! I'm going to put together a list of various communities that will fit comfortably into a ten gallon and let my father pick! I've had so many good suggestions so far =D

[Lolita]

I do have a question, though--I have a standard hood with a light fixture in it. If I get low-light plants like anubias, will they be alright with a standard light? I don't want to have to go out and buy a whole new top fixture if this light will do the trick well enough. I'll be using eco-complete substrate and flourish excel as well.

[Lab_Rat]

I would love to just instantly cycle my tank, but unfortunately the tank I have at home is still cycling. I don't mind cycling the tank here, though--I'll be doing both at the same time, so it'll be kind of interestin to see the differences between the two, if there are any lol!

But the LFS is in a different town, so their water is from a different source. However I did find water softeners so I'll give them a try and see if it makes a difference!

I wouldn't advise trying to change your pH with chemical additives. You'll likely get pH swings which are very bad for the fish. If you want to try a safer way to soften the water, add driftwood as decor and put some peat in the filter (in a media bag of course).

As far as the lighting, you might be ok with whatever standard fixture you have. You can put aluminum foil behind the bulb to act as a reflector. This seems to help with standard lighting.

[Lolita]

I wouldn't advise trying to change your pH with chemical additives. You'll likely get pH swings which are very bad for the fish. If you want to try a safer way to soften the water, add driftwood as decor and put some peat in the filter (in a media bag of course).

As far as the lighting, you might be ok with whatever standard fixture you have. You can put aluminum foil behind the bulb to act as a reflector. This seems to help with standard lighting.

Oh, sorry--the water softener I was talking about was actually a filter sponge, not a liquid chemical. I'll double check what it is, and look into some peat, thank you!

As for the light, that's a great idea! I'll give that a try after I clean the tank and hood today.

[Wild Turkey]

If you want to use peat to lower ph your gonna want to get the peat "nuggets" and bag them otherwise its a huge mess. Wood is a lot easier and looks great

I agree I wouldnt mess with the ph, it being stable is most important. Most beginners put way too much stock into ph and not nearly enough into ammonia/nitrite/nitrate and the cycle process. I would forget about changing the ph and just drip acclimate all the fish I introduce

[Lolita]

If you want to use peat to lower ph your gonna want to get the peat "nuggets" and bag them otherwise its a huge mess. Wood is a lot easier and looks great

I agree I wouldnt mess with the ph, it being stable is most important. Most beginners put way too much stock into ph and not nearly enough into ammonia/nitrite/nitrate and the cycle process. I would forget about changing the ph and just drip acclimate all the fish I introduce

Ooh, is pH directly related to water hardness? I feel stupid not knowing that. I didn't actually think about the pH of the water, I've never worried much about that, I was more worried about the calcium in the water. xD but if they're directly related, I feel dumb. LOL

I'll see if Petco / Petsmart have any driftwood I like. I'm going to pet smart today because the petco by here doesn't sell water hardness tests, and it turns out the kit I have has everything BUT water hardness D: tagic.

[Wild Turkey]

Yup they're related, add calcium and you raise the ph, filter it out and it drops. Its one of many dissolved solids that form the buffer which keeps the ph stable.

[Lolita]

Yup they're related, add calcium and you raise the ph, filter it out and it drops. Its one of many dissolved solids that form the buffer which keeps the ph stable.

Oooh, I understand. So the harder the water, the higher the pH. Got it.

This is the water softener I was talking about before: [Only Registered Users Can See Links.]

[Wild Turkey]

Yup, you got it

I think those are reusable so I would just dry it out and store it away for if you ever need it

[Lolita]

They say they are yeah.

Fantastic! I'll grab some on my way home today. Ordered my eco-complete and filter today, so they should be in next week. I wish I had the money to pay for overnight shipping lol but it was like...150 dollars.

I'll just have to be patient. Thanks for your help!!

[vegas2k]

we have hard water out here in Vegas..water is pH of around 7.6, good thing is...I am doing goldish, and they like pH around 7.5 :)

[Lolita]

we have hard water out here in Vegas..water is pH of around 7.6, good thing is...I am doing goldish, and they like pH around 7.5 :)

Goldfish are great. I loved mine before he died. He was awesome, and he loved people. I could put my hand right in the tank and it didn't phase him one bit.