To sump or not to sump, that is the question...

[thecoolguy]

ok guys - as you may know - i had originally decided on getting a rena xp3
and going about my filtering like that - for my 75gal.....

but, now.....the sump has come to mind --- so first off.....you can sump for a freshwater right? i know it is more common in salt, but do freshwater guys do it also?

what is all the fuss about? seems easy enough....my plan is as follows....

1 - get 2 holes drilled in tank (at top) for 2 pvc pipes to drain water out the top

2 - down to sump tank that will contain heater / filter / powerhead

3 - powerhead pushes water up to original tank where i plan on having a long pvc tube distribute water to the surface via drip-down holes

ain't that about right? given you do a sump though, i have some integral questions for you sump guys out there....

1) if my main tank is a 75gal, what is the smallest sump tank i can get? i was thinking 30-40 gal

2) how do you make sure the flow out of tank, matches the flow back into the tank --- my main fear is that the flow out will be too high and the sump tank might overflow because the powerhead doesn't push water out fast enough....and vice versa, if powerhead is too strong, the holes won't pull enough water out of main tank fast enough resulting in overflow

3) can you downsize the filter used - go from my rena xp3, to a simple bio-wheel filter? b/c of the increased flow and total water amount?

thanks for the help guys.... i promise there will be pictures once this is all said and done.....

[Chrona]

1)Yes, you can sump for freshwater. The main issue is cost. Sure it will look nice because you can have your heater and everything hidden from sight, but you still need a filter in the sump, unless you build your own acrylic sump, and make compartments for the various media. Plus you run the risk of overflow. 30-40 would be a good size. Just make sure it fits in your cabinet with plenty of room.

2) Not sure on this one, but IIRC, most sump systems invovle an overflow from the top of the tank, so as the sump pump puts water into the tank, more flows out, in the sump, available for the pump to pump up until some kind of balance is achieved

3) No, you will still need just as much filtering capacity, perhaps even more because technically you now have 110+ gallons of water. It doesn't matter how much water your pump pumps. If your filter only puts out 400gph, then that's you total filtering capacity, because the pump will just pump back dirty water.

Personally, I don't think it would be worth the trouble to get a sump for a 75g

[genitor]

What about turning the sump into a diy wet-dry filter?

[thecoolguy]

appreciate the input chron....

found out some more stuff - including a video of tank vs sump size.....

for a 90gal tank - a 20gal sump would work, GIVEN that the intake from the main tank is at 2" below water surface level -- this is because at that point - if all pumps were to be shut-off, the sump would not overflow

so, that narrows it down to the main tank overflowing - which i guess will simply have to be controlled with the method of returning water to the tank....i.e. the number of holes i may drill in the drip down tube.....

lastly - if you can attach acrylic to glass - then i would most likely just
make the compartments within the sump for filtration - i could probably even fashion a bio-wheel as the first level of filtration using the water coming down to spin it....haha...

i think it may end up being worth it.....

rena xp3 + additional small bio-wheel: $150-200

sump: $30-50 for used 20-40 gal, acrylic $20-40, filtration materials $30-50
total: $120-150

i guess cost can be reasonably less -- and it would provide superior filtration in my opinion given the fact that you are increasing water volume, overall flow and aeration -

worth taking a chance....

[thecoolguy]

What about turning the sump into a diy wet-dry filter?

100% honestly - i don't know squat about wet-dry filtration.....

any good links?

[Chrona]

Wet dry systems are probably overdoing it a little. I wouldn't even bother for a freshwater tank

You can get Rena XP3's from Dr foster and smith for 99 bucks. An additional emperor 400 is about 35 bucks. You aren't really saving that much money and the canister + emperor 400 will provide more than enough current + filtration for a 75g. Keep in mind you would have to silicone-in compartments in your sump to hold the media and direct water flow, and that's all easier said that done. If you are very good and building stuff then by all means go for it, but I think (and I usually like making my own stuff) that a canister filter is much better in terms of convenience, ease of cleaning, and probably price. The advantage of canisters is that because they are sealed, they actually force water through the filter media, whereas with sumps, the water trickles/filters through via gravity. Combine the mechanical abilities of the canister with the 2 giant biowheels of the Emperor and you have a really nice, reliable system.

[thecoolguy]

Wet dry systems are probably overdoing it a little. I wouldn't even bother for a freshwater tank

You can get Rena XP3's from Dr foster and smith for 99 bucks. An additional emperor 400 is about 35 bucks. You aren't really saving that much money and the canister + emperor 400 will provide more than enough current + filtration for a 75g. Keep in mind you would have to silicone-in compartments in your sump to hold the media and direct water flow, and that's all easier said that done. If you are very good and building stuff then by all means go for it, but I think (and I usually like making my own stuff) that a canister filter is much better in terms of convenience, ease of cleaning, and probably price. The advantage of canisters is that because they are sealed, they actually force water through the filter media, whereas with sumps, the water trickles/filters through via gravity. Combine the mechanical abilities of the canister with the 2 giant biowheels of the Emperor and you have a really nice, reliable system.

well said.....that deserves a foshizzle....

renaxp3 to emperor400 it is then...

BUT .... sometimes, i cannot stop the builder in me.....this might still happen

[Chrona]

well said.....that deserves a foshizzle....

renaxp3 to emperor400 it is then...

BUT .... sometimes, i cannot stop the builder in me.....this might still happen

Er just to clarify, the Emperor would be a separate unit that is mounted on the opposite side of the tank as the canister filter inlet/outlet. I didn't want to make it sound like you are to hook up the canister to the biowheels in the Emperor and was merely pointing out that they make for really good biological filtration (not that there is anything wrong with the biomedia in the XP3)

[thecoolguy]

Er just to clarify, the Emperor would be a separate unit that is mounted on the opposite side of the tank as the canister filter inlet/outlet. I didn't want to make it sound like you are to hook up the canister to the biowheels in the Emperor and was merely pointing out that they make for really good biological filtration (not that there is anything wrong with the biomedia in the XP3)

don't worry chrona, i know.....haha