Fluval 405 canister

[Bok]

We will be getting a 90gal tank that comes with a Fluval 405 that is just a couple of months old. We've heard differing opinions about the filter, everything fromthe best to the worst. What do you think?
Can bulk media be used or does it have to have cartridges?
90gal freshwater community

[Halo819]

I am using the Fluval 405 on my 90 gal Oscar tank.
It is stocked pretty heavy with:
2- 12 inch Oscars
2- 4 inch Pink Convicts
1- 4 inch Jack Dempsey
1- 5 inch Pictus Cat
1- 5 inch Pleco

The 405 keeps my water sparkling clear! Maintenance is a breeze and comes about very infrequently. I would have preferred an FX-5 but they were unavailable to me when I set the tank up. I am very satisfied with the 405! thumbs2:

[Deleted User]

All my filters are fluvals and I have never had a problem with any of them except when I have needed new parts because of there age.:ssmile:

[Bok]

Thanks for the replies folks. One thing I read (complaint) was that it is a nitrate factory.I don't understand that. Nitrates are converted from nitrites so.....??
What kind of media is usuallu used?
Quite a lot of differing opinions about them and as I mentioned they go from one extreme to the other.
I have a friend that uses two and she swears by them.
The load will be 1 bala shark, 4 neons that come with the tank plus our 8 white clouds, 10 or so guppies 2 corys, 2 ottos and a 6" pleco.

[terrapin24h]

Essentially, "nitrate factory" refers to the filter's ability to produce massive amounts of nitrate(which in very high concentration are toxic) due their capacity to hold inordinate amounts of debris. If you don't clean it enough, said debris collects and rots in the filter, fostering a massive beneficial bacteria colony that processes all that waste into nitrate. Too much of a good thing, as it were. However, this is a trait(no pun intended) of ANY canister filter, and even bio wheel HOB filters. The bacteria gets all the oxygen, space, and food it needs to thrive, and it does. The solution? clean the thing(get the rotting debris out of the filter), do proper water changes, and don't over feed(IOW be a studious fish keeper). I have both a 205 and a 405(just a few months old each) and like them. My media arrangement in the 405 on my 65gal tank is as follows, starting at the bottom:
lowest basket: crushed coral in filter bag covered by lots of filter floss
2nd up: lots more floss
3rd up: bio media(i use fluval's that the filter came with)
4th up: yet more bio media covered in floss for polishing(this floss will prob not need replacing but once a year)

--chris

[Bok]

Thank you terrapin. Sounds good and I think that is how we will go. The floss we use is in a sheet (blanket) and is inexpensive. Do you cut to the basket size and use a few layers of it or do you just crumple it up and put it in?

[terrapin24h]

Thank you terrapin. Sounds good and I think that is how we will go. The floss we use is in a sheet (blanket) and is inexpensive. Do you cut to the basket size and use a few layers of it or do you just crumple it up and put it in?

Depends. If i have the sheet stuff i do layers, if i have the fluffy mass stuff i just use a big wad. The thing to keep in mind about floss is that it compresses once it gets wet--so you need to over stuff the tray a little bit

Also, another thing i forgot to mention about my 405. It has a habit of developing impeller rattle(despite fluval sending me a new impeller), but i have learned the trick to fix it. On the 405 the impeller shaft gets inserted into a little rubber seat which then goes into a hole in the bottom of the impeller well. The trick is to pull the shaft out(with the seat on it) and then re-insert the shaft only part way. Then put the impeller back in then replace the well cover. I've done this twice now and it seems to eliminate the rattle. I don't know if yours will do this, but keep that in the back of your mind in case it ever does. Once done, the filter runs very quiet, lots of flow.

--chris

[Bok]

That's interesting about the impeller seat. A common complaint about the filter from those that don't like it is the rattle. I found it odd that some were quiet, some weren't.
So,with the seat too high on the shaft it doesn't seat properly. Makes sense.
Looking forward to getting this tank and having a good look at the Fluval. Hopefully this Saturday!
Now, where do we put our refrigerator...hmmmmm...

[Paw Broon]

I'm jealous of all you people with big tanks! Sounds like it will be a nice tank, are you going to bump up any numbers of the fish like the neons or corries?

[terrapin24h]

That's interesting about the impeller seat. A common complaint about the filter from those that don't like it is the rattle. I found it odd that some were quiet, some weren't.
So,with the seat too high on the shaft it doesn't seat properly. Makes sense.
Looking forward to getting this tank and having a good look at the Fluval. Hopefully this Saturday!
Now, where do we put our refrigerator...hmmmmm...

I think it's actually not the stem in the seat, it's the stem *and* seat in the hole in the impeller well. What i think happens is that there is too much vertical clearance between the top of the seat and the bottom of the impeller well cover. By only inserting the seat and stem partially into the hole in the well, you reduce that clearance and alter water flow/pressure enough to keep the impeller from cavitating in the well and making the clacking sound(in hind sight, nylon washers stacked on top of the impeller would prob accomplisht the same affect). I thought to try it for two reasons: first i have a eclipse filter that does the same thing. If you sink the impeller in the well it rattles. Pull it up a bit and it's silent. Second, I noticed on the 405 when it was rattling if I closed the aquastop valve about 1/4 way the rattle would go away. This told me that the impeller was too loose. When the back pressure against it went up, it was put under enough load to stop bouncing about. Just a theory. Hopefully you won't have a clackety one and this discussion will be moot thumbs2: Now go move that fridge!

--chris

[Bok]

If its clackety, fine, I can fix it thank you thumbs2: We've had the same problem with a couple of HOB's resulting from the top end of the intake not seated properly.
We so appreciate your input on this. This is our first 'big' tank, the next largest down are a couple of 27's and we are still relatively new at this so anything else at all you can think of in regards to the larger sized tank that might be of help, just jump right in. We aren't totally clueless but...!

[Bok]

I'm jealous of all you people with big tanks! Sounds like it will be a nice tank, are you going to bump up any numbers of the fish like the neons or corries?

Going to take this off topic a bit :) Here's even more reason to hate us...the tank, the whole set-up-- stand, everything... is a freebie.
An acquaintance we haven't been in contact with for some time sent us an e mail just to catch up on news. We knew they had a tank a year or so ago, we asked about it, told them we got bit by the bug and he told us they were losing interest in it, mainly due to time constraints and wanted to get rid of it. We asked "How much?" and we were told "Come get it and its yours."
I had just started pricing glass for a DIY tank about that size because there is no way we could afford to buy one. We needed it mainly for the 6" pleco that came with and is still housed in a 27gal. We can't hand off the pleco (Cookie Monster) to someone with a bigger tank because he and my wife are now buddies. :1luvu:
The new tank comes with a 12" pleco and a 6" bala shark which we will find larger home(s) for. Love to keep them but their comfort comes first. There are 4 neons with them which we will keep. We know the 48" 90 is still small for our pleco but its a start in the right direction. Just can't do more right now.
Along with our pleco and their 4 neons will be our 8 or so white cloud minnows, about 10 guppies, 3 balloon mollies, a couple of corys and ottos. We would keep the bala but from what we have read it would be best with others of its kind and a larger tank. Damn. These plans aren't written in stone, we'll see. We want to add more to it, we do like schooling types.

[Bok]

....My media arrangement in the 405 on my 65gal tank is as follows, starting at the bottom:
lowest basket: crushed coral in filter bag covered by lots of filter floss
2nd up: lots more floss
3rd up: bio media(i use fluval's that the filter came with)
4th up: yet more bio media covered in floss for polishing(this floss will prob not need replacing but once a year)
--chris
We've picked up the tank. installed etc., looks good! Turns out to be an 80, not a 90 but geeze, it was free!!
Set it up yesterday. First thing I did was throw in about 25 gallons of de-chlorinated water and vacuumed the gravel. Filled it, ran it without cleaning the filter from the original owner, added his fish. Only difference between him still owning it and us, we did a 100% water change and vacuumed.
We noticed last night the water looked cloudy about three hours later, still like that this morning. Here is what his schedule/filter medium consists of:
Cleaned the filter once a month.
Rinsed the white ceramic media once a month with tank water.
Rinsed the half the carbon once a month with tank water. Changed half the carbon once a month.
Rinsed the foam once a month with tank water. Changed the foam every four months.
That's it.
I suspect that if I filter it as you do Terrapin, the cloudiness will go away especially with the addition of all that floss. Do you think that is what is lacking in ours?
It is a beaut! So quiet we can hear a pin drop!

[terrapin24h]

We've picked up the tank. installed etc., looks good! Turns out to be an 80, not a 90 but geeze, it was free!!
Set it up yesterday. First thing I did was throw in about 25 gallons of de-chlorinated water and vacuumed the gravel. Filled it, ran it without cleaning the filter from the original owner, added his fish. Only difference between him still owning it and us, we did a 100% water change and vacuumed.
We noticed last night the water looked cloudy about three hours later, still like that this morning. Here is what his schedule/filter medium consists of:
Cleaned the filter once a month.
Rinsed the white ceramic media once a month with tank water.
Rinsed the half the carbon once a month with tank water. Changed half the carbon once a month.
Rinsed the foam once a month with tank water. Changed the foam every four months.
That's it.
I suspect that if I filter it as you do Terrapin, the cloudiness will go away especially with the addition of all that floss. Do you think that is what is lacking in ours?
It is a beaut! So quiet we can hear a pin drop!

How long was the whole thing shutdown for? It's possible that the whole system is shocked and you are undergoing a bacterial bloom. It's also possible that you just stirred up a bunch of crud with the move, especially if the filter was emptied of water and the hoses disturbed(gook tends to build up in them and then spew out when the filter is turned on) Can you describe the cloudy water you have a bit more? That'll help. Also, i'd pull his carbon--many here don't really use carbon unless we are trying to remove meds from the tank. Also, i think the standing opinion on rinsing the bio media is don't unless it gets clogged. If you have enough media in front of it, no particulate matter should make it to get caught and clog the media. My filters are fully seeded and running tanks, and thier bio media looks no different than the day i set them up. Dont forget pics!

--chris

[Bok]

How long was the whole thing shutdown for? It's possible that the whole system is shocked and you are undergoing a bacterial bloom. It's also possible that you just stirred up a bunch of crud with the move, especially if the filter was emptied of water and the hoses disturbed(gook tends to build up in them and then spew out when the filter is turned on) Can you describe the cloudy water you have a bit more? That'll help. Also, i'd pull his carbon--many here don't really use carbon unless we are trying to remove meds from the tank. Also, i think the standing opinion on rinsing the bio media is don't unless it gets clogged. If you have enough media in front of it, no particulate matter should make it to get caught and clog the media. My filters are fully seeded and running tanks, and thier bio media looks no different than the day i set them up. Dont forget pics!

--chris
It wasn't shut down for anything other than the move, about an hour and a half, tops. I do agree it does look like bacterial bloom. Can't describe it much better than that, it looks like a bacterial bloom which would imply what?.. I don't think he cleaned the filter so the colony should have been there, and we did nothing but vacuum the substrate.Plus the 100% water change.
Okay, did a water test and all parameters are normal except nitrites, at a very low level. I know zero is what it should be but it is between 0 and .25, not in the color range to put it at .25. Have to keep an eye on that. This and the cloudy white I feel suggests I better get a look at whatever is in the filter, keep what I can to retain bacterial culture and at the same time duplicate what you use.
I keep carbon in our filters just to retain bacterial colony that is in it, we don't change them. These have been in our HOB's since we started this new found interest, about 4 months I guess.
One more point of interest.. when we were filling the tank two buckets (5 gallons each) were cloudy. We took it for granted that it was air. That is 10 gallons out of 80.
I'll try to add a pic, first time on this forum. You will see a reflection of our monitors, don't be alarmed lol

[Bok]

I've just now re-adjusted the powerhead to redirect flow and we can see 'clouds' of white. We can clearly see what looks like a very fine particulate.
The filter...hmmmm... come morning I'm taking that sucker apart.

[terrapin24h]

Do not leave carbon in indefinitely. Over time, it can leech stuff back into the water. From your pics, it looks like a bacteria bloom to me too, but if you say you are seeing particulate in the water it could very well be something kicked loose. When the move was going on, was the filter media kept wet? If not, alot of it may have died off(the fact you are getting a nitrite reading kind of leads me to that question) If you see the level go up or not go down, you might want to think about using a bacteria booster(stability, etc) to helpyour cycle along in restarting.

--chris

[Bok]

Good morning!
The gravel was kept wet, packed in plastic lined boxes.
This morning the water is considerably clearer so I'll wait out today and keep an eye on it. I won't be cleaning out the filter if it does clear up and we'll keep an eye on the nitrite (and all) levels.
This didn't start until maybe a couple hours after the filter started so it may very well be as you say, something kicked loose. The fish appear to be happy, not stressed at all. We removed some of the ornaments that came with the tank and added a few plants and will expand on that. Possibly post pics in an appropriate thread on that subject when the time comes.

I've been told by a few people to relax, wait a couple days. Patience is something that causes me physical pain lol Fortunately my wife has a big pointy stick to keep me under control :)
I received a pdf file that contains the owner's manual for the Fluval and I'll go over it. Interesting machine.
Off to work, thanks again and have a great day eh.

[terrapin24h]

Good morning!
The gravel was kept wet, packed in plastic lined boxes.
This morning the water is considerably clearer so I'll wait out today and keep an eye on it. I won't be cleaning out the filter if it does clear up and we'll keep an eye on the nitrite (and all) levels.


The gravel was wet, but what about the biomedia in the filter? Was it wet? That's where the lion share of the bacteria live. Sure, there is some in the gravel, but way more in the filter. Gravel alone cannot support a full bioload(unless you are running a UGF). If the bio media in the fluval dried out, the bacteria there is most likely mostly dead and will need to re seed. That would explain your fog as a bacteria bloom.

Regardless, whatever the cause, the solution will be the same. Wait it out and keep an eye on your water levels. Enjoy the new tank, looks awesome!

--chris