White, cottony growth

[pedsdoc]

Hi all, newbie here but have done a lot of research...
Problem: White, stringy cotton-like growth that occurred one week after putting plant in tank. Plant turns out to have been a bulb from a wal-mart store, and local pet store owner told me to not worry...

My Tank: 30 gal, cycling for 5 weeks, no fish yet, gravel, eclipse 3 hood, one plant, and one piece of driftwood that I persoaked for 10 days. KH 0, GH 0, pH 6.5, Nitrite/Nitrate 0, ammonia 0.5 (have been adding pure ammonia to "feed" bacteria until I get fish next week). Light on 12h cycle. Using Cycle product, no water changes yet. I had put some flake food two weeks ago before I read about pure ammonia.

?fungus, mold...was told algae is not white. No snails in tank, or other animals.

I have pics, but not sure how to post.
Thanks!
Pedsdoc

EDITED BY WILLIAM TO ADD PICTURES:
http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/images/whitestuff1.jpg
http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/images/whitestuff2.jpg

[ryanwms]

I can't help much with your tank problem, but to post pics, what I do on another website that uses this same Forum program, is to upload the pictures to another website I have, and then just add a link to the image in the textbox you use here to post. Your message will then post to the web browser, and it will find the command to load a picture, using the directory you have specified on another website.

Hope it helps, let me know if you need more info.

[William]

You can aslo upload the picture to the photo album and link to it. (or you can email them to admin(at)aquaticcommunity.com and i'll add them for you.)

Is it just a plant or have the problem spread? If it is just the bulb it might be that it has died and/or get infected with fungus.

[William]

Yes, That looks like some kind of fungus. I would try to remove what I could with my fingers and then keep an eye on it so that it don't spread.

Some antifungal chemical might also do the trick but I usually try to avoid chemicals as long as possible.

[pedsdoc]

Thanks to Willaim for the help posting pics! I am very imressed with this forum, such rapid response.
I have no fish yet. My plan for this tank is about 4-5 plants (ordered), 4 Discus , 2 coreycat and, perhaps, a small school of neons. Discus should be delivered in about 10 days, so I am quite interested to get this problem fixed before they arrive. I do plan on moving up to a 55 gal in a year, or so.

One more question (feel free to comment on my plans as well), should I just get rid of the "cheap" plant, or work with it?

Thanks, again

[William]

About your planns. The neontetras might end up as food for the Discus. Observe might as it might work fine to keep them togheter.

I would perhaps keep a few more cory cats as they to best in schools of atleast 5-6.

I would keep the cheap plant as it will be very nice hen it grows bigger ;-)

[pedsdoc]

I just tried cleaning some of the white growth off, and it was actually pretty well widespread through the gravel/driftwood and plant. I decided to treat with antifungal tabs (nitrofurazone and furazolidone).
I moved my carbon filter so that it is mostly out of the flow. WIll I have to add Cycle once this is done to re-populate bacteria, or are tha above drugs just going to kill fungus.

Thanks!

[pedsdoc]

OK, thanks for your help, I did order more corey cats to help them get along better. I primarily want a Discus tank, so here is my question:
I treated with the antifungal 3 days ago. Apparantly, the local fish store guy has ordered my discus, and they will arrive in 2 days. Will I have do anything else to ensure that I haven't "ruined" my bacteria by treating for the fungus?
My last check: pH6.5; KH, GH, Nitrite/nitrate all 0, Ammonia <.5 (will a 30% wc prior to adding fish).
Oh, (isn't there always a btw...) I tried to get substrate and more plants prior to getting the discus...since the order is delayed, should I hold off until the fish "settle in" for a month, or so. I kinda think the benefits of the plants outweigh the stress to the fish while planting.

Thanks again!
Doug

[William]

I can't say for those for certain with those drugs but I think that the bacteria should be ok. But keep a close eye on the ater values just to be on the safe side. A question, Did you use the carbon filter while treating for fungus. The filter will in that case most likely cancell out the antifungal tabs.

I would add the substrate and plants when they arrive as I think they will help more than the damage the stress causes. The substrate will also help support a better bacteria culture in your aquarium.

[pedsdoc]

William,
Now I am stuck. 4 discus arrived today, but substrate and plants aren't arriving until tomorrow. (I ordered them 2 weeks ago, so that was supposed be a non-issue).
just go ahead and plant them? Getting anubias, java fern and ozelot sword.
Tank looks great, paramaters all good (except pesky "low" ammonia). Did 30 % wc while acclimating fish and plan every-other-day 20% changes until things stabilize. Gonna keep lights off for 2 days, and feed very sparingly (and not this evening).

Thanks

[William]

I say go ahead and plant them. Discus are hardier than they are made out to be, atleast if you hae gotten your hands on quality fish. The ultimate choice however is up to you as it is your fish.

Otherwise you can just let your plants float around in the tank a few days before you plants them but I don't recommend that you leaving the swordplants floating for too long. The anubias and javafern can go long times without planting since they never are planted in the conventional sense.In fact I've used anubias nana var nana as a floating plant that is great for protecting fry ;-)

The sword plants will last longer without planting if you attache the to something so that they sink or if they are poted and sink from the weight of the pot.

let me know what you choose and how it turn out.

[pedsdoc]

Thanks... I will probably take a "portion" of the eco complete substrate and put it under the gravel where I plan to plant the sword plant so as not to create too much debris in the water column. I plan to then plant the sword during the next water change and either float or plant the others (If fish eating well, will just go ahead and plant).
Thank you for all your help! My fish look great! I am so glad I chose discus, and I will keep reading!

[pedsdoc]

William, Well I did exactly what I mentioned in above post. I ended up tying anubias to stone and java fern to driftwood, and planted Sword after putting about 4 cups of eco complete under gravel in one corner.
After about 48 hours since fish in tank, I am a bit worried. I haven't seen anyone eat yet. Fins look a bit ragged and they are a bit dark especially the "cobalts". They really hate the lights on, but now that I've planted I have to keep some on.
Added salt today and increased temp to 86, small amt of ammonia, pH 6.8 and others 0. I actually did 2 20% wc today due to plants, and will do about 20% wc daily until ammonia 0.

Any other advice? I am pretty worried now. Fish were very cold when I picked them up, and them being dark and not feeding makes me think they were worse off than I thought.

[William]

Actually discus are not too found of salt so don't over use it. Also the plants won't mind that you keep the light of for a couple of days. This will in fact help the plants root better.

WHich temperature do you keep? What do you try and feed them with?

[pedsdoc]

William,
Tank is now at 86 degrees. Had to move up slowly since the fish came so cold and looked dark, started at 80 degrees. Salt is only 1-1.5 tsp per 10 gallons.
Feeding New Life mini pellets that sink, and tonight I got some cichlid small floating pellets and put those in as I dimmed the lights. Didn't see them going for them, though. I don't have access to live food, pretty much whatever walmart sells unless I order it online.

[pedsdoc]

William, I am sorry to say that all 4 discus died over the past 24 hours. I am very upset about this. I planned so much for these fish. As it turns out, many of the fish that the LFS ordered from this company in conneticut, have died.
So, problem with the fish, or problem with my tank?!?! I had placed 3 coreycats in the tank on the same day as the discus and they (of course) are doing great. I didn't quarantine, but these fish looked very dark for the beginning, never ate, and died all in 4 days. I doubt it was something that the coreys had. My water parameters weren't perfect, but they were quite reasonable, and I was doing the prescribed water changes. (I stopped adding salt).
If I want to get more discus, help me plan how to ensure this doesn't happen again!
Thanks!

[William]

Hi
First of let me say that I am really sorry for your loss.

That you didn't quarantine them isn't an issue as they where the first fish into the tank and hence couldn't introduce any disease etc to other fish and you had good water conditions in your tank.

I would say that the problem almost certainly poor quality fish and as you say almost all of the fish from that shipment died not just the ones you got which implies that it wasn’t due to an error on your part but rather due to a shipping error or low quality fish from the get go.

I would most likely request new fish or a refund from the LFS if I where you, whether that will work without a larger fight or not depends open your shop but My personal experience says that it usually not a problem a larger problem to get new fish under conditions like these. (Keep in mind however that I’m not from your area so I can’t say for sure how it will work for you, I’m European.I do however know that at least some more respected dealers in the state would compensate you in this situation. As it was a problem with all fish and not just yours.) And if I understand it correctly and most fish died in the entire shipment the LFS might want to consider asking for a redelivery from the supplier.

If you decide to try and get some new discus (and don’t get new ones as compensation for these) I would recommend you to find a small local breeder to buy from. They are usually cheaper and often have higher quality fish that you can se before buying them. I can also recommend a few companies that will ship discus to you and only sell high quality fish.

Once again sorry to hear about your loss and please let me know if there is anything morei can do.

Sincerely
William

[pedsdoc]

William,
Thanks for the encouragement. The LFS had 90% loss of the fish in my order (about 40 total fish). Hopefully they will "make good" on this. The coreys are still looking good, but WILL NOT be planning to keep them. He has a QT tank to place them in.

After grieving a few days, I re-thought my plans. Ordered a 46 gal bowfront. Will have it planted and keep 4 discus, plus a few other peaceful fish. I needed to find something to fit in my smallish office, and a 48" 55 gal was just too big. The 36" bowfront was a good compromise.
So, once it gets delivered, will start from scratch. Actually set up 10 gal a few days ago to use as a QT tank. Put the plants in there with a couple danios to get it to cycle quickly. If It works, it won't take me quite as long to get the 46 gal cycled.

Question: Should I place new Discus in by two's, or get all 4 at once? I don't want to stress fish, but also want the tank to have a stable bacterial colony.

[pedsdoc]

Oh, forgot to add- Will either order through Discus Hans or a local (2 hr away) small breeder/dealer. Both have good recommendations.

[William]

Hi
I would add all 4 discus at the same time to avoid that the first two form territories and make life though for the second two.

I would however keep some other fish in the aquarium for a while to get the bacteria flora working. You can either remove these fish to one of your other tanks when the discus arrive or choice a species that will work good with discus. You could for example add a few apistagrammas in the tank which would do well with the discus when they arrive.

[pedsdoc]

William,
Thanks for the info- found a "local" dealer and will be getting four 3" discus once tank is cycled. I was hoping to go through fishless cycle, but I tried that the first time, see what happened. What do you think of keeping the coreys in the new tank to cycle it? I treated with two doses of Sulfa, just in case.
They seem healthy. Too much risk for the new discus??

As always, Thanks for all your time. I can see you really care about fish, and new people in the hobby!

[William]

keeping the corys in the tank should work just fine. just keep an eye on yoru water values just in case.