So frustrated!

[Cichlid*Newbie]

Well two fish died as i posted in an earlier thread..and tonight i went to feed again, and an orange ones fins were like pretty much gone, they're picking on him, I took him out and put him in a bucket, had to do something until morning..

Soo in the tank now left are a male kenyi (largest and meanest), three yellow labs which dont appear to be picked on..so far..and one more red zebra who has a small bit out of his fin...what should I take out of the tank/leave in? I think im going to have to seperate them but which ones can I leave together?

[Northernguy]

Remove the fish that is starting all damage!

[Cichlid*Newbie]

well im not sure i think its the two big ones left...i have the "sick" one in a bucket..the rest are ones i put in later i think..so they are younger..

How long will they live in the bucket..im not sure what I should do really..

[Cichlid*Newbie]

So I have the sick one in one smaller bucket..and the two mean ones in a rubbermaid, i put in a couple ornaments and one of my bubblers...hoping the other ones left in the tank will live...wow, I didn't realize how mean cichlids are..think i like community fish lol...they seem more calm.

how long can I leave them in the buckets...? I tried to put tank water, but id done a water change yesterday so had to use some new water as well.

agg what a mess

[Gemini]

Have you got any air in the bucket? If not, then I would be putting new water in and running an air stone or a filter would be best.
How big is the tank? Is there only the remaining 5 fish now?

[Wild Turkey]

In any containers with fish at least run a gentle airstone and change 50% of the water everyday. Once the beat up fish is able to swim well by itself, i would return it to the main tank. If this is a cichlid tank, its especially important to run an airstone in whatever water the fish is in to diffuse any co2 in the water or that may build up from the fish, which would drop the ph.

[Cichlid*Newbie]

Left in the tank now are 3 yellow labs and a purple kenyi...i put bubblers in both the bucket and the rubbermaid..(which are loud because i dont have any airstones..so its just the tube..grr)

I think I might sell the male kenyi that did the damage and possibly the red zebra that isn't injured..i dont know where to go from here...maybe a few days will let the others gain their strength back...?

[Cichlid*Newbie]

In any containers with fish at least run a gentle airstone and change 50% of the water everyday. Once the beat up fish is able to swim well by itself, i would return it to the main tank. If this is a cichlid tank, its especially important to run an airstone in whatever water the fish is in to diffuse any co2 in the water or that may build up from the fish, which would drop the ph.

Well the beat up fish can swim on his own...just they picked at his fins..he seemed weak..

Even now one of the male labs is still chasing..man cichlids are annoying lol...maybe I should just let them kill each other off, it def would be easier lol.

I like the male kenyi, id rather keep him, he is (was) my favourite, but I can't put him back in there..

[Wild Turkey]

Some people find that controlled over stocking in african tanks is one solution to aggression. However it does mean more work.

[Sharon]

That is "the nature of the beast'....Do you have lots of rocks to provide hiding places? The Kenyi is much more agressive than the Labs, so probably not a good tankmate. I haven't read your other thread yet, so I'll do that now.

[Cichlid*Newbie]

well everyone survived the night...

the kenyi that is left in the tank is pretty timid...i was thinking of setting up another small tank if i can find one cheap to just put the aggressive ones in for now...?

im thinking of introducing the picked on zebra back into the tank..also had a couple email saying theyd take them

[ko4000]

What size tank are these guys living in? A minimum of 4' is recommended. Mbunas and Kenyi's in particular are very territorial and if the tank is too small the Kenyi may claim the entire tank as his own in which case you have no choice but to re-home him or get a bigger tank.

Are there lots of caves/hidey spots for them? Again they are very territorial for feeding and breeding grounds and will fight for tank dominance. They need lots of rock work to provide hiding spots and to create different territories. They just dont attack another fish b/c they are mean, although that is what it can look like on occasion.

Check out this link. There is a good section on Mbuna Behavior and aggression management.
http://www.cichlidforums.com/knowledgebase/idx.php/0/045/article/Malawian-Mbuna-Guide.html

[ko4000]

OMG! I just took a look at your profile and saw you are keeping these guys in a 29g. Any Mbuna you put in there are going to have problems, simply not enough room. Especially Red Zebra which can grow to 6 inches and Kenyi who are highly territorial.

[kaybee]

29gal + mbuna's=increased aggression which leads to increased potential of aggression-related casualties.

55gal minimum for mbuna's (75gal recommended minimum if any of the species belong to the metriaclima or melanochromis genera).

Solution=larger tank (4ft tank length as previously mentioned) + well structured gender ratio's (1 male per several females per species).

However, fully matured males of some hyperdominant species (of which the kenyi is one) won't tolerate other fully matured males of their species in the tank regardless of gender ratio).


...I didn't realize how mean cichlids are..think i like community fish lol...they seem more calm....

Aggression is a natural trait of the majority of cichlids. To which degree that aggression attains depends on species and variables. Aggression among mbuna's can be counter-balanced with a variety of tactics once the nature of their aggression is understood.

[Red]

I have tried to keep mbuna in a 29. It does not work at all, and turns into a blood bath. If you want to keep africans keep some nice shellies...

[Cichlid*Newbie]

Unfortunately I can't upgrade right now, so I dont have many options, think that I might have to give away the male kenyi and the zebra that are being aggressive for now..i can't do much else..

heres a pic of the picked on zebra

[domjd05]

I keep mbunas in a 55g, I only have 8 in it, and even like that they are aggressive towards one another, if you can't upgrade tanks it looks like you should maybe ask your LFS if he'll take your current fish in trade for some that arent as aggressive...

[Cichlid*Newbie]

Well I am down to 5 fish now in the tank...the one in the pic was doing okay all yesterday back in the tank..came home today and he was still alive but had no fins at all, poor guy I felt so bad, got my bf to take him out and put him in the freezer, I wasn't sure what else to do, is that the proper was to euthanize them?

[Little Embers]

That is a real shame Cichlid*Newbie!

Here is a link to another thread in which euthanasia is being discussed!
http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aquariumforum/showthread.php?p=517159#post517159

[kaybee]

Well I am down to 5 fish now in the tank...

Due to mbuna nature small numbers also enhance aggression (e.g., aggression would be higher in 75gal tank with 5-8 mbuna's than in a 55gal with a dozen of them).

A small tank with a low number of mbuna's is a receipe for disaster.

I recommend trading them in for some peaceful tropicals.

In regards to the fish you had to put down, I've had a pseudotropheus socolofi get beaten up worse (lost all coloration, nearly all fins torn and missing body scales, which settled to the bottom of the tank immobile,breathing heavy on its side and irresponsive for 3 days before it regained its equalibriuum and ability to swim). The fish completely recovered in about a month and was relocated to another tank. 2 years later that fish is still around and doing well.

I never count mbuna's out (but it takes a hospital tank to get them back to recovery).

[Mith]

Even if a person "does his homework" prior to stocking, that's not to guarentee there won't be fatalities.

The size of your tank as others have said... uh...


I've euthanized quite a few fish. Depending on the size... I use sewing sizzors to quickly decapatate them. I don't feel it to be cruel.... it's QUICK.... That's the ONLY way I'd kill a fish, maybe with some chemicals that put them to sleep... but who has those?

[Flowcus]

Clove oil safely puts fish to sleep and you can get it all over the place. There are plenty of articles to euthanise fish this way out there. Its also a GREAT tranquilizer for fish if you need to do any kind of inspection, or maintain them in anyway ( like trim a puffers beak )

Decapitation without an ice bath first probably still has some pain factor to it, and it just doesn't seem right to me. Best method IMO and most peoples opinion is an ice bath then the freezer. Otherwise look into using clove oil.