Hi everyone. Advice needed on everything!

[texasdiver]

Hi folks:

Found this forum in my quest to educate myself more about aquarium management and also to plan for the next step up in size. Currently we have a 10 gallon Wal-Mart tank with 4 small goldfish that my wife and I originally got for the kids. However I'm finding it difficult to maintain water quality in such a small tank, and my wife has been clamoring for a much larger tank for our front entry. So I'm looking for the next big step up to a proper freshwater aquarium. But I'm sort of overwhelmed by the options and choices.

I'd welcome any advice, recommendations, or criticism with what I'm thinking.

1. Tank. The local fish shop here in Waco Texas pushes 55 gallon packages with tank, filter, lights etc. That seems like a reasonable size tank. However I would contemplate any arguments or reasons for why we might want to go larger, or to a different size or shape. It will be in our entry hallway so a rectangluar tank is required, no corner or hex shapes.

2. Filters. They are sold with the traditional hang-on-the-back filters. I'm just starting to educate myself on filters. We'll probably be going with goldfish to start and maybe an algae eater. I have always liked the gravel filters that bubble up and might put one of those in as a secondary filter. Does it make sense to just use what comes with the package or is there a good reason to buy this stuff a-la-carte and upgrade to a different filter?

3. Stands. I do a good bit of woodworking and have a garage shop that is adequate for making furniture cabinetry. I was thinking of making my own stand and canopy out of birdseye maple. Something in a modern design similar to this one:

[Only Registered Users Can See Links.]

4. Plants. I'm thinking plastic to start. Keeping live freshwater plants seems like a pretty big challenge.

5. Fish. Probably just an assortment of larger goldfish that will do OK in an unheated tank. This is really going to be more up to my wife though.

[texasdiver]

I'm looking for decent plans for furniture-quality aquarium stands and canopies. I haven't found anything I like on the internet so far. Lots of plans out there and examples built by non-woodworkers using dimensional lumber (2x4s etc) that are designed more for strength. But I haven't seen any really nice furniture-quality plans. The examples of stands in the pet stores have been really disappointing.

Any pointers?

[Abbeys_Mom]

Welcome to the foum :)

[*Sarah*]

Hi and welcome!

[Rue]

I'm in the same boat...planning a larger tank...

We also looked at 55 g, 75 g, and 90 g...

The difference between 55 g and 75 g is width...the extra width gives you an extra 20 gallons...length is the same...

The difference between 75 and 90 g is height...giving you another 15 gallons...

We settled on getting a 75 gallon...there's more I can do with the extra width...the 90 gallon is just taller, which doesn't help me...in fact, I can't easily reach the bottom for cleaning - and that cinched it! I don't want to be stressing about cleaning! And the jump in price from 75-90 is astronomical!

For goldfish, you have to make sure that the tank never gets too warm...and that you filter properly...being big bodied fish, they produce an incredible amount of waste...they also eat live plants, so I'd stick with silk...

I agree with you on the stands too...would like to have one made, but it seems impossible to find anyone willing that will do it economically...I might have to resort to buying one from the petstore...

[Chrona]

1. Tank. The local fish shop here in Waco Texas pushes 55 gallon packages with tank, filter, lights etc. That seems like a reasonable size tank. However I would contemplate any arguments or reasons for why we might want to go larger, or to a different size or shape. It will be in our entry hallway so a rectangluar tank is required, no corner or hex shapes.

Larger is better of course :)
2. Filters. They are sold with the traditional hang-on-the-back filters. I'm just starting to educate myself on filters. We'll probably be going with goldfish to start and maybe an algae eater. I have always liked the gravel filters that bubble up and might put one of those in as a secondary filter. Does it make sense to just use what comes with the package or is there a good reason to buy this stuff a-la-carte and upgrade to a different filter?

What kind of filter is it? Goldfish are very dirty fish, and so require more filtration than usual. Plus, it's never really a bad idea to overfilter. The bubbles you speak of are actually just air-stones supplied by an air pump. They simply oxygenate and stir the water. For a larger tank like 55-90, you should consider a good canister filter. For instance, I've heard great things about the Rena XP3, which is rated for like 350 gallons per hour. As for the algae eater, I'm sure many people will disagree, but I kept a common pleco in a cold-water (I'm talking COLD. I live in New England) tank with my goldfish and he did fine. His metabolism and movement was slower than usual, but he adapted, did his job and lived all the way until I sold the tank recently. Obviously it wasn't the ideal environment though. I'm not sure if there are any cold-water algae eaters, but I could be wrong.

3. Stands. I do a good bit of woodworking and have a garage shop that is adequate for making furniture cabinetry. I was thinking of making my own stand and canopy out of birdseye maple. Something in a modern design similar to this one:

[Only Registered Users Can See Links.]

It's tough to tell what the internal supports look like on that, but keep in mind water weighs 10 pounds per gallon, and the weight of the tank and substrate will add even more. It's better to have too much support than not enough and have the stand start sagging later on.

4. Plants. I'm thinking plastic to start. Keeping live freshwater plants seems like a pretty big challenge.

Yep, the KISS principle is always good

5. Fish. Probably just an assortment of larger goldfish that will do OK in an unheated tank. This is really going to be more up to my wife though

[Severus]

Welcome to AC

[texasdiver]

What kind of filter is it? Goldfish are very dirty fish, and so require more filtration than usual. Plus, it's never really a bad idea to overfilter. The bubbles you speak of are actually just air-stones supplied by an air pump. They simply oxygenate and stir the water. For a larger tank like 55-90, you should consider a good canister filter. For instance, I've heard great things about the Rena XP3, which is rated for like 350 gallons per hour. As for the algae eater, I'm sure many people will disagree, but I kept a common pleco in a cold-water (I'm talking COLD. I live in New England) tank with my goldfish and he did fine. His metabolism and movement was slower than usual, but he adapted, did his job and lived all the way until I sold the tank recently. Obviously it wasn't the ideal environment though. I'm not sure if there are any cold-water algae eaters, but I could be wrong.

Not sure. I assume it is just a generic hang-on-back filter rated for at least the 55g tank size. I'll go down to the shop today and look. As for the water temperature. This is Central Texas (Waco area) and our house is usually in the mid-70s or higher, especially in the summer when I keep the air set to 77 or 78. I don't have a thermometer in the tank now so I don't know what it is. After doing some more reading I'm thinking maybe going with tropicals rather than gold fish. They seem more interesting and perhaps easier.

I also found this link to underwater jets which are supposed to keep the gravel clean so maybe I'll make some of these to combine with a hang-on-the-back filter: [Only Registered Users Can See Links.]

It's tough to tell what the internal supports look like on that, but keep in mind water weighs 10 pounds per gallon, and the weight of the tank and substrate will add even more. It's better to have too much support than not enough and have the stand start sagging later on.

Yep, Whatever I build it will be totally over-engineered. I gave a rather close inspection to the painted pine stands at petsco and was thoroughly underimpressed. They are just cheap pine that is stapled together. Anything I build will be at LEAST 10-times more solid. I also noticed that none of the pet-store stands have solid tops. Only the edges of the aquarium are sitting on the stand and the glass bottom is entirely unsupported. I guess this is standard practice as the bottoms are recessed. But it seemed odd to me. A solid top will prevent twisting and racking of the stand to some extent, which seems a good thing. Luckily my aquarium spot is in a tiled entry of a slab foundation house so I'm guessing I can put any amount of weight there.

[Chrona]

I've never tried a UGF, but most people here will tell you to stay away, as they tend to break and are a pain to maintain.

And yes, imo, tropical fish are MUCH more interesting, since there is a greater variety and you can make a really nice community tank.

[Incredulous_Ed]

Welcome to AC
I believe the 55 gallon has a filter that says 30-60 gallons? am I right? If you are going top be keeping goldfish, you will need much more filtration.
As for the stands, I built on for a 20 gallon using spare 2x4s ans a piece of plywood. It could easily hold the weight of a 55 gallon setup. And it's a good idea to stay away from ufg's, they do more harm then help.

[Faith_at_Large]

I will leave the big tank details to the experts here, but I would like to suggest (if you haven't already thought of this yourself) that you keep your ten gallon tank operating as a quarantine/hospital tank after you have moved up to the larger tank. A ten gallon tank is well suited to this purpose and you use it as a temporary tank to house new fish (one or two at a time) for a few weeks before adding them to your main tank - this way you can see if they are carrying any diseases from the petstore or other fish supplier, before they infect the rest of your prize goldfish. This size tank also provides a treatment facility for fish if they look sick or injured. This separate facility allows you to treat the fish, without treating the main tank (less meds needed) or radically changing it in a way that is hard to get back to normal - i.e. it is easier to do a salt or med bath in the smaller tank. Just remember to clean the quarantine tank between uses if you do have sick fish in there.

Some folks I know that keep goldfish store them in tanks in the winter but put them outdoors in their ponds for the summer. Personally, I am big on tropical fish and I have a Wal-Mart ten gallon tank with a small group of Zebra Danios and two Red Platys and lots of fake plants - it looks so beautiful and the fish are endlessly entertaining.

[KneeKickLou]

Welcome to the forum. Just a few things that I learned from starting might be able to help you. 1) Take your time. If you rush and try to much to fast youll loose fish. 2) Fishless cycle its usually faster and no harm to the fishes. 3) Research Research Research. Get as much information as you can before you make any choices. 4) Listen to the people here they are very helpful and know what they're talking about. Good luck with the tank and hope everything goes well.

PS I second Chrona tropical fish give you so much more variety in setup and or fish and for the price of a heater I saw why not. Plus some of those goldfish just freak me right out.

[Rue]

...no no no! How can you say that? LOL...fancy goldfish are my all time favourites...

I'm just so sad that our house gets too hot for me to keep them upstairs during the summer...

The tropicals tolerate the temperature increase just fine...

My 2 goldfish are happily living in the basement...but I only see them in passing down there...I try to stay away from the 'kids' space' since it tend to stress me out (the mess...;))

[texasdiver]

The kits they are selling are Marineland 55 gallon kits that include the following:

55 gallon glass tank
two lids with lights
Penguin 350 Biowheel filter
Heater
Conditioner.


Seems like decent equipment and a giant step up from the Wal-Mart sort of kits. Any comments on this setup?

I did price 75, 90, and 110 gallon tanks out of curiosity but the 55 gallon seems like the appropriate next step. One assumes that the larger tanks wouldn't be so much more expensive but then after inspecting them it became obvious that you are buying MUCH thicker glass with those large aquariums given that the weight of the water goes up geometrically with the increase in dimensions.

So I think I'll stick with the 55 gallon. Then in a few years if we're still into this hobby we can leap up to something really impressive.

[cocoa_pleco]

welcome 2 ac