Cycle finally started

[Cichlid_Man]

Hi,
I posted here a few days ago about my 40 gallon that I started up 2 weeks ago with fish.

Today is the first day I see any sign of cycling and I have a question.

First of all I used some gravel from an established tank and some stress zyme right from the start.

Now, after 2 weeks, I have a .25 ammonia and a .25 nitrite but zero nitrate.
Water is a bit cloudy but fish are doing fine.

What should I do from here?
Are those numbers "normal" for a cycle that is starting out?
Thanks!

[Lady Hobbs]

Normal numbers for a beginning cycle and that stress zyme is holding those toxins down for you. You're right on track.

[Cichlid_Man]

Normal numbers for a beginning cycle and that stress zyme is holding those toxins down for you. You're right on track.

That's what I want to hear Hobbs!

So, just maintain the normal water changes each week, and I should be OK in about another week or so?

[Lady Hobbs]

You need to check toxic levels daily. Never know when you could get a spike and you wouldn't want to lose any fish.

[Wild Turkey]

You need to check toxic levels daily. Never know when you could get a spike and you wouldn't want to lose any fish.

I agree, test daily regardless. Do waterchanges if A/Ni go above 1.0ppm

[Cichlid_Man]

I agree, test daily regardless. Do waterchanges if A/Ni go above 1.0ppm

Thanks Hobbs and Wild Turkey.
I will make sure to check each day.
Right now they are hovering at .25 ammonia and nitrite, no nitrate.
I'll keep ya'll posted.

[Cichlid_Man]

Hi folks,
The ammonia is up to .50 from .25 but the nitrite has remained at .25.

I do, however have a trace of nitrate now at .5.

What should I do.

All fish still look ok except my baby bala. I didn't expect him to make it and I was going to give him away anyway, but is there anything I should do?

Any water changes yet

[Lady Hobbs]

PMed. No point in repeating myself. LOL

[Northernguy]

If you chose to cycle with fish than do a water change every time you see a spike.
With those numbers I would be doing at least 50% daily until your ammonia and Nitrites are down to 0 and you nitrates are under 20.
Get some Seachem stability or Tetra Safe Start for you tank,you will have an instant cycle.Everyone who uses this stuff is getting an instant cycle!

[Cichlid_Man]

If you chose to cycle with fish than do a water change every time you see a spike.
With those numbers I would be doing at least 50% daily until your ammonia and Nitrites are down to 0 and you nitrates are under 20.
Get some Seachem stability or Tetra Safe Start for you tank,you will have an instant cycle.Everyone who uses this stuff is getting an instant cycle!

I was first told to do small water changes, like 10% every other day.

I will go by what you say and do a larger change.
As I stated, my ammonia level is .50, nitrite remained at .25 and nitrate is at 5ppm.

I'll keep you posted. BTW - That baby Bala died since I last posted....
I never got a chance to get him into my son-in-laws tank. All others look fine for now.

[Northernguy]

Get something to boost your cycle if you can!
Small water changes are fine for routine maintanence but do little for lowering any spikes.
Sorry to hear about your Bala!

[Cichlid_Man]

Get something to boost your cycle if you can!
Small water changes are fine for routine maintanence but do little for lowering any spikes.
Sorry to hear about your Bala!

Well, the Bala wasn't in good shape when I first brought him home and I will get a refund on that.
Anyway, I did a 50% change and there was no change at all in the perameters.
ammonia - .50
Nitrite - .25
Nitrate - 5ppm

I can't get to town till tomorrow and all I have is stress zyme for now.

I'll see if I can get that tetra safe. I don't know if they stock it.

These fish may just have to weather the storm, unfortunately. I live to far from anything.

I couldn't even get pure ammonia to do a fishless cycle. That's why I bought fish. I don't want you to think I am heartless.

[Northernguy]

LOL I don't think you are heartless!:22:
Tetra safe start is the name of the product you want.Seachem is very good as well.Your fish store should stock either one.

[bushwhacker]

do another 50% w/c you really need to drop that ammo level, it wont hurt your tank and will really help the fish

[Cichlid_Man]

Thanks to all.
Unfortunately, the 2 fish supply stores within an hour of me never heard of either tetra safe or the seachem, I would have to drive 2 hours to Richmond Va. to get it or have it shipped.
Tomorrow I will do another major water change, but now I am losing my clown loach also. I am really upset. I should have known not to put a loach in there. Oh well....I have been at this for many a year and still learning.

The other fish are doing fine....

I will replace the loach later on....he is covered under store warranty and so is the Bala

[Cichlid_Man]

OK....Here's where I am now.
I got a bit impatient so I did the 50% w/c last night around 9 P.M.

I got up this morning and before feeding the fish I checked the perameters and they looked better.

Ammonia is barely above zero. It doesn't even read .25. If I had to guess, I would say it was .10

Nitrite is the same way. Hardly a trace.

Nitrate remained at 5ppm

After the water change I added more stress zyme.

Questions:
1. Should I still try to find the Tetra safe start?
2. Is it safe for more fish yet?

[Lady Hobbs]

You are using the Stress Zyme so not much point in adding another one. If you do find some, use it instead of the Stress Zyme but I don't think having both products will do much.

You don't want to remove all your ammonia as you need it to cycle. Let your water tests quide you in how much you change. Higher levels of toxins need larger water changes. They should not get too high with that Stress Zyme as it's made to hold the toxins down.

Cyling is hard on fish. It's the prolonged toxic levels that do them in. They are breathing ammonia day and night for days and then have to go thru the nitrite levels, too. They either get darned tough or die......generally die. It also weakens their immune system and you'll have to watch for ick and fungus.

I would again urge you to go to your son in laws and grab his nasty filter stuffing. You would get this over with far faster.

[Cichlid_Man]

I did get the filter stuff from my son-ion-law, last week.
I also used 2 pounds of fish store dirty gravel AND the stress zyme.
I lost the bala and then the clown loach.
The numbers are better though. I think the remaining fish will do fine.
There is hardly a trace of ammonia and nitrite now, but I will watch for spikes

[Lady Hobbs]

Really? This is awesome. I thought you had decided against using his stuff. Yahooo. You will probably have that tank done then very, very fast.

Good Jobbers! You are awesome

[Cichlid_Man]

Really? This is awesome. I thought you had decided against using his stuff. Yahooo. You will probably have that tank done then very, very fast.

Good Jobbers! You are awesome

Well, my wife may be headed to town today. I know they don't carry the tetra safe start, but they do have Seachem Stability. Can't hurt. They say you can add fish immediately.

I want rainbow sharks so bad.

[Lady Hobbs]

http://www.elmersaquarium.com/10shark_redrainbow.htm

Get one then. I would take your other bala back and get the rainbow if you want one.........one. LOL

[Sharon]

Agree! Take the Bala back...he's going to be trouble in a 40gal.tank anyway!thumbs2:

[Cichlid_Man]

Agree! Take the Bala back...he's going to be trouble in a 40gal.tank anyway!thumbs2:

The Bala died. I will take him back for a refund along with my clown loach, and buy 2 rainbow sharks.

The fish store in town carries Seachem Stability but not Tetra Safe Start. Northernguy says they are both good.

I will let you know

[Sharon]

Better get just one...there will be problems with two, as they won't tolerate their own kind.

[Cichlid_Man]

Better get just one...there will be problems with two, as they won't tolerate their own kind.

Yup!
I just read Dr Tim's fish compatibilty chart and he says either 1 rainbow, or "a bunch". I don't want a bunch, so I'll go with 1.
Thank you!

[Cichlid_Man]

OK,
I put in the required amount of Seachem Stability last night, and then again this morning.

My readings now are:
ammonia: zero
Nitrite remained at .25
Nitrate = zero

I introduced a clown loach and 1 rainbow shark and there are no signs of stress.
Only thing, how do clown loaches react? I know they are bottom dwellers and like logs and caves, but mine is swimming around like he is an olympic swim champ. I mean all over the place....mainly when the light is on.

[Sharon]

Personally, I would have waited for the cycle to be stable, before adding more fish...especially Clowns. Clowns do like to be in groups...and one is not going to do well alone. I find that when they are young they are less seclusive, than when they get older.

[Northernguy]

Cichlid_Man Keep adding it for 7 days and continue to monitor your perameters.You should not have any large spikes.
I do agree with a few more clown loaches but wait for the tank to stabalize!
http://www.seachem.com/Products/product_pages/Stability.html

[Cichlid_Man]

Cichlid_Man Keep adding it for 7 days and continue to monitor your perameters.You should not have any large spikes.
I do agree with a few more clown loaches but wait for the tank to stabalize!
http://www.seachem.com/Products/product_pages/Stability.html

At least there is no ammonia.
Nitrite or nitrate at small levels are rarely dangerous.

I had a clown loach alone when I had my 75 gallon tank, and he just seemed to tag along with the pleco, and rainbow sharks.

That's what he is doing now.

As far as the Seachem, I did see the instructions to add 5 ml per 20 gallons for 7 days. I bought the small 100 ml bottle and I need to finish it all.
Thanks to all for all your assistance

[Northernguy]

Nitrites kill fish too so watch they do not get too high!
Keep up the good work!:22:

[Cichlid_Man]

Nitrites kill fish too so watch they do not get too high!
Keep up the good work!:22:


My good work comes from everybody's support here :-)

3rd day of Seachem and ammonia and nitrite are now zero :-)

Still a trace of nitrate, but I will do a water change when I am stabilized.
5ppm nitrate is acceptable anyway.

[Cichlid_Man]

My good work comes from everybody's support here :-)

3rd day of Seachem and ammonia and nitrite are now zero :-)

Still a trace of nitrate, but I will do a water change when I am stabilized.
5ppm nitrate is acceptable anyway.

My previous post was wrong.
My nitrites are still at .25 and I am worried.

I don't think you are supposed to do water changes while using Seachem Stability. 3rd day of using it and the nitrites are still the same.

What should I do?

[Sharon]

I don't think I'd do a water change with .25ppm nitrites, unless fish are looking stressed, but I wouldn't let it get any higher.

[Cichlid_Man]

I don't think I'd do a water change with .25ppm nitrites, unless fish are looking stressed, but I wouldn't let it get any higher.

Ok thanks, I will wait on a change and let the Seachem work.
The fish all look fine. Very active, no red gills or anything like that.

The Danios and Rosy Barbs are doing the best. All the other look great too, but they seem to spit out the food. Maybe they are not used to it. I give them TetraMin but I am sure the LFS used cheaper stuff.
They must be eating something or they would be dead by now.

[Sharon]

Try some Bloodworm...most fish love them!

[Cichlid_Man]

Try some Bloodworm...most fish love them!

Good idea when I can get back to town. I find they also like the frozen brine shrimp but not to give them too much.

It seems now they are picking off the bottom.
I guess sharks and loaches are bottome feeders anyway. I'll keep a watch on them but I wish this water would clear up and stabilize.

[Northernguy]

There are much better brands of food!
Hikari and NLS are about the best out there.
How long has your water been cloudy?

[Cichlid_Man]

There are much better brands of food!
Hikari and NLS are about the best out there.
How long has your water been cloudy?

I thought tetramin was tops for community tanks, but I will take your word for it and change.
My tank clouded up on day 2 after set up.

It's not the filter and it shouldn't be new tank syndrome with the seachem.
I did major water changes before the seachem to make sure all perameters were at zero.
Somethings wrong.

[Northernguy]

Give it some time!Things should clear up soon!
Keep watching your perameters and your fish.
If you do end up doing a water change do not clean your filter and add more Seachem afterwards.

[Cichlid_Man]

Give it some time!Things should clear up soon!
Keep watching your perameters and your fish.
If you do end up doing a water change do not clean your filter and add more Seachem afterwards.

I am noticing "possible" reddening of the gills on the loach. He's moving too fast for me to get a good look.

Maybe I will wait till after lunch and see if todays dose of Seachem did anything, and if I still see .50 nitrite and 20 ppm nitrate, I am going for at least a 25% change which is only 10 gallons in my tank. Maybe I'll do 15 gallons and re-add the Seachem.

[Northernguy]

Reddening of the gills is caused by high ammonia and you are testing 0.
Can you post some pictures?

[Cichlid_Man]

Reddening of the gills is caused by high ammonia and you are testing 0.
Can you post some pictures?

I think we misunderstood each other.
I started to panic because my numbers changed. I have.25 ammonia, .50 nitrite and 20 ppm nitrate.

I went ahead and did the 30% change and added back the seachem accordingly.

Here is a picture of the loach but I don't think you can see what I see. He just won't stay still.

[Cichlid_Man]

I just want to let ya'll know that this morning the ammonia is zero, but the nitrites are still at about .50 and nitrates are about.10.

Also, I found my rainbow shark IN THE FILTER this morning. I have no clue how he got in there. He doesn't look so good but I am giving him a chance.

[Northernguy]

Your rainbow shark must have over swam the water flow! lol
I am surprised he made it into the filter instead of onto the floor!
I can't see how it would even get into the filter!Is it an HOB?
Your tank sounds like the cycle is building fine.
Keep monitoring your perameters,your nitrites should drop soon.
What other fish besides the shark and the clown are in there?

[Cichlid_Man]

Your rainbow shark must have over swam the water flow! lol
I am surprised he made it into the filter instead of onto the floor!
I can't see how it would even get into the filter!Is it an HOB?
Your tank sounds like the cycle is building fine.
Keep monitoring your perameters,your nitrites should drop soon.
What other fish besides the shark and the clown are in there?

He could have jumped in there when I did the w/c yesterday, but that means he spent the entire night in there.

The water is clearing up nicely now and I think I am on my way. At least the ammonia is gone.
Thanks for your help and I will keep you posted. BTW - the shark looks better now and might make it...a little banged up, but looking better :-)

[Lady Hobbs]

You are doing great and so is that tank. Don't add any fish until your tank is done cycling and then add only one or two every week or so.

Hope your shark makes it!

[Cichlid_Man]

You are doing great and so is that tank. Don't add any fish until your tank is done cycling and then add only one or two every week or so.

Hope your shark makes it!

Thanks Hobbs!
The tank is crystal clear now and numbers are not bad.

That crazy shark!
He is still swimming a bit funny but he looks like he'll pull through.
If not, there is a 14 day warranty on him :-)

[Sharon]

......that's cold comfort for the shark!:hmm3grin2orange:

[Northernguy]

......that's cold comfort for the shark!:hmm3grin2orange:

It should teach it to stay out of the jacuzzi!lol

[Cichlid_Man]

Ya'll are funny!
I was looking for about a half hour to try and find him, then I decided to check the filter.
Sure enough there was a red fin sticking up from the floss.
I though for sure he was dea, but when I tried to gently lift him out by the tail, he flipped around and there was hope.
He is now swimming pretty normal, but he has some marks on him.
I added stress coat. We'll see.

[Northernguy]

If it is swimming around normally than he should be fine!Those marks should heal up no problem!:22:

[Cichlid_Man]

If it is swimming around normally than he should be fine!Those marks should heal up no problem!:22:

Well, I sure was real gentle with him. I first touched his tail as I already said, and when I saw he was alive, I just turned off the filter, took it off the back, and he just jumped into the tank on his own.
He is under my bridge right now but doesn't seem to be stressing.

I am more happy about my water!
Clean and clear and no ammonia.
Thanks for the tip on Seachem and the 30% w/c.
It is working!