Beginner's Fishless Cycling Journal

[Dirty Name]

This thread is intended to help me stay on course during my first ever cycling process - based on the advice I'm getting here, I've decided (against the urging of my wife and children) to do a fishless cycle.

Here are the details.

BASIC SETUP:
26-gallon bow front tank (20-inch depth)
Flourescent lid light
Aqueon Filter
Aqueon Heater
Thermometer
Air pump with Alligator-shaped air stone
Multi-level structures and plants (all artificial)
Substrate gravel (rinsed clean)
Master Test Kit

DAY 1 (end of first full day):
Water temperature: 80 degrees
Water clarity: crystal clear
pH: 7.6
Ammonia: 0.5ppm
Nitrites: Did not test
Nitrates: Did not test

Please recommend any adjustments or actions.

Will post Day 2 results tomorrow.

[doug z]

Excellent!

Thanks for this!

Can you record how much ammonia you are adding each day? What kind of ammonia it is? Running the air-stone 24/7?

You're going to get your ammonia ppm up to 4-5, right?

[Dirty Name]

Yes, I am running the air stone 24/7...please let me know if I should not. Also, if you know, please share in what way the air stone affects the cycle. Does it increase ammonia levels, for example? I have no idea.

As for adding amonia, the answer is, I haven't added any in the first 24 hours - should I have done so?

I will record all data on this going forward, but any advice/guidance would be helpful.

[fins_n_fur]

Please click on the free ebook link in my signature to learn about how to do a fishless cycle. You can also read the stickies in the cycling forum. Effectively, you need to adding enough ammonia to keep your ammonia levels at about 4-5 ppm per day until you see nitrites being produced. If you haven't added ammonia, I'm puzzled as to why you show .5 ppm.

[schoolbus]

Keep Your journal going. I've kept a journal on each of my tanks from day one.
If and when You run into problems, Your tank history will be Your best friend.

Don

Keep Your eyes on the road and Your hands upon the wheel.

[Mvjnz]

It's probably the plant material and possibly some snails which are giving the ammonia reading.

In another forum I'm a member of, the normal way to cycle a tank is to set it up with plants and everything, and then just leave it for 4-5 weeks without adding anything, other than maybe the occasional pinch of fish food.

So strictly speaking, you don't NEED to add ammonia to cycle the tank, but if you do it means you can add more fish at one time after the cycling has finished.

[gourami*girl]

It's probably the plant material and possibly some snails which are giving the ammonia reading.

In another forum I'm a member of, the normal way to cycle a tank is to set it up with plants and everything, and then just leave it for 4-5 weeks without adding anything, other than maybe the occasional pinch of fish food.

So strictly speaking, you don't NEED to add ammonia to cycle the tank, but if you do it means you can add more fish at one time after the cycling has finished.

He has artifical plants in his tank, so the ammonia is not the plant material or snails and the tank will not cycle by itself.

Dirty Name, three questions:
1) First how are you adding ammonia for your fishless cycle?
2) Do you know anyone with an established fish tank? Getting some gravel or filter medium from them will speed your cycle along.
3) Have you tested your tap water for ammonia? Also, I have read that some dechlorinators can lead to an ammonia reading, maybe test your tap water for ammonia before and after adding dechlorinators.

Good luck!

[Mvjnz]

A tank WILL cycle by itself if there are live plants in it. I know hundred of people in a forum who have done it.

But in this case, maybe there's ammonia in the tap water?

[Lady Hobbs]

http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/aquariumforum/showthread.php?t=5640

[Dirty Name]

He has artifical plants in his tank, so the ammonia is not the plant material or snails and the tank will not cycle by itself.

Dirty Name, three questions:
1) First how are you adding ammonia for your fishless cycle?
2) Do you know anyone with an established fish tank? Getting some gravel or filter medium from them will speed your cycle along.
3) Have you tested your tap water for ammonia? Also, I have read that some dechlorinators can lead to an ammonia reading, maybe test your tap water for ammonia before and after adding dechlorinators.

Good luck!

Answers:
1) I haven't that I know of...I tested yesterday and it came up 0.5ppm (after waiting 5 minutes per the instructions on the master test kit)

2) No, I'm new to the Alexandria/DC Metro area

3) Tap water test results are posted below. Please note, I did add 10ml of dechlorinator that came with the Aqueon kit. plus another 15ml of a different brand which says it actually removes chlorine AND ammonia (oops).

Meanwhile...

My tank water is noticeably cloudier than it was last night. There are no fish or snails in the tank yet.

Tank Water Ammonia Test Results this morning at 8:05am:
It looks to be between 0.25~0.5ppm

Tap Water test results:
Ammonia is 1.0ppm

Given my ill-advised addition of 15ml of chemicals that remove ammonia, this reading makes sense.

I'm guessing the community advises I should add ammonia?
Should I already be testing for nitrites and nitrates as well?

[Lady Hobbs]

Ammonia = NitrItes = NitrAtes

Read link in prior post. Cycling really is very easy but just made to sound hard.

[geowashlaw]

It's also very slow ... I added my ammonia on Friday, 13 Dec and did not get nitrites until Wed, 17 Dec... they are still only reading at 0.25 ... and my ammonia is not coming down any ... for ammonia, since you are in the DC Area, find a Harris Teeter and get their store brand ... everyone says use Ace Hardware's store brand, but there isn't going to be one of those near you (us) ... I found good stuff at HT in Ballston ... I would offer you some already cycled media, but I am using it on my new tank :-) ... I could give you a handful of pink gravel (my girls picked it out), but I don't know exactly how much you would need ... I'm just over in Vienna ..

[gourami*girl]

Mvjnz, yes, planted tanks can cycle by themselves. I was saying that Dirty Name's tank will not cycle without a source of ammonia because his plants are artifical. Sorry for the confusion.

Dirty Name, The 1ppm tap water reading, was that before or after adding dechlorinator? If it is before, then you will be adding ammonia to your tank every time you do a water change. I'm not sure how much of a problem this would be in a cycled tank.

[Dirty Name]

The 1.0ppm reading is straight out of the tap. Please advise. Is this normal?

[Northernguy]

No it is not normal.There should be no ammonia in your tap water.Is there any Nitrites or Nitrates in the tap water?
Call whoever is in charge of your water and make them aware.I don't think that consuming any ammonia can be good for you!
Read the link that Lady Hobbs posted so you get a better idea of what you are about to start.Learning about it will make the suggestions we give make more sense.
Good Luck and way to go on deciding to go the fishless way!:22:

[doug z]

Yes, I am running the air stone 24/7...please let me know if I should not. Also, if you know, please share in what way the air stone affects the cycle.

Read that info in the link that Hobbs provided..

That will answer pretty much ALL of your questions..

And if you have more, you know where we are..


Yes, I am running the air stone 24/7...please let me know if I should not. Also, if you know, please share in what way the air stone affects the cycle.

Good.. Bacteria need oxygen, too.. :)

Like I say, everything is in that link, so read that first!!

[Alfcea]

Good.. Bacteria need oxygen, too.. :)


Yes. When the ammonia/ammonium is oxidized into nitrites, bacteria need oxygen to do that transformation. And then, in the next step, again oxygen is added to the nitrites to form the mitrates. Without oxygen (or in case very little of it is present), the cycle cannot go forward...

[Dirty Name]

Ammonia: 0.25ppm
Action taken: Added 25ml

pH: 8.2, previous reading of 7.6 was max limit of test kit (goal=7.0)
Action taken: Added 1 TSP pH Down

Nitrites: 0.0 ppm

Thanks for the guidance again and am reading the online guide and everything else I can get my hands on.


No it is not normal.There should be no ammonia in your tap water.

I spoke with the guy at the LFS, he seemed to be informed and helpful. I asked him about the ammonia in the local tap water, he said that was totally normal...so I guess I don't know what to make of that.

Anyone else have experience with small ammonia levels in the tap water?

Related question: Fish Store Guy told me the local tap water has chloramine, not chlorine, and that chloramine does not evaporate like chlorine does - thus I supposedly need to buy something that will remove chloramine.

Please let me know if this guy is shooting me straight.

[doug z]

thus I supposedly need to buy something that will remove chloramine.

Yup, same dif..

Same thing to buy- dechorlinator..

[nwnittany]

I spoke with the guy at the LFS, he seemed to be informed and helpful. I asked him about the ammonia in the local tap water, he said that was totally normal...so I guess I don't know what to make of that.

Anyone else have experience with small ammonia levels in the tap water?


Yes - my tap water tests about .25ppm of ammonia.... I believe some water treatments (e.g. stress coat) that claim to neutralize ammonia don't actually eliminate it, they convert it to ammonium, which many test kits still report as ammonia. I think the net result is that by using the water treatment on your tap water you will make the water safe for your fish, but it will still test out as having some ammonia (which is really ammonium). I also believe the nitrifying bacteria will process ammonium in the same/similar way it processes ammonia.

So, I think you're OK. A sanity check on what I wrote would be helpful, if someone wants to chime in....

[Dirty Name]

Ammonia: 0.25ppm (strangely, it looks like it's actually slightly more toward zero than before).
Action taken: None - instructions on NUTRAFIN "Cycle" bottle appear to indicate that I shouldn't add anything else for another six days...

High range pH test: 7.8, (down from 8.2ppm)
Action taken: Added another teaspoon of pH Down

Nitrites: 0.0 ppm

Water temperature: 77 degrees
___________________________________

Is there a better product for boosting the ammonia levels in the tank than NUTRAFIN "Cycle"?

Also, I'm eyeing the artificial plants in the Betta bowls I have nearby...would there be any benefit to tossing those in the new tank? The Bettas might miss them, but would it boost the ammonia in my cycling process?

The wife and children are hearing from others now that we don't need to "cycle" the tank and I'm just being a bit too meticulous.

Would be awesome if the little ones could wake up Christmas morning and Santa had put fish in the tank...but I'm guessing that we'll be about three weeks premature.

[bushwhacker]

"cycle " isnt adding ammonia to your tank its supposed to add the nitrifing (sp) bacteria you have to add the ammonia somehow a pinch of fishfood or put a few zebra danios in that tank to supply the ammonia the bacteria need

[gourami*girl]

Ammonia: 0.25ppm (strangely, it looks like it's actually slightly more toward zero than before).
Action taken: None - instructions on NUTRAFIN "Cycle" bottle appear to indicate that I shouldn't add anything else for another six days...

High range pH test: 7.8, (down from 8.2ppm)
Action taken: Added another teaspoon of pH Down

Nitrites: 0.0 ppm

Water temperature: 77 degrees
___________________________________

Is there a better product for boosting the ammonia levels in the tank than NUTRAFIN "Cycle"?

Also, I'm eyeing the artificial plants in the Betta bowls I have nearby...would there be any benefit to tossing those in the new tank? The Bettas might miss them, but would it boost the ammonia in my cycling process?

The wife and children are hearing from others now that we don't need to "cycle" the tank and I'm just being a bit too meticulous.

Would be awesome if the little ones could wake up Christmas morning and Santa had put fish in the tank...but I'm guessing that we'll be about three weeks premature.

If the betta bowls are relatively new than the plants will not help much as the bacteria you need for your cycle will not be established in these bowls, either.

I don't know much about Cycle, but I thought that it was a product that was supposed to help the bacteria for your cycle grow, but didn't actually add any ammonia. If you want to speed up your cycle, you may want to look for an additive that actually contains the live bacteria. I have heard that Tetra Safestart is a good product for this if you can find it.

To fishless cycle your tank you will need to add ammonia somehow. Most suggest pure ammonia if you can find it (have an ACE hardware around your house?) Others allow a shrimp to decay in the tank (will smell bad) or add fishfood. Bushwacker suggested zebra danios - not a fishless cycle if you use these, but the hardiest fish to use if you do a fish cycle.

To me it looks like you have two options:
1) Continue with a fishless cycle after finding a source of ammonia to add to your tank - will probably take 4-6 weeks then fish can be added to a completely cycled tank.
2) Find and dose Tetra Safestart which in ideal conditions will give you an "instant cycle" then start with a few hardy fishes (zebra danio would be a good choice) that will survive a mini-cycle if the safestart does not work as well as advertised. This is not the safest option, but your fish will most likely be fine and you can have a few fish in the tank for your kids at christmas!

**If you choose option 2, moniter the ammonia and nitrite levels very carefully (every day) and preform 50% water changes as often as necessary if you see readings for these two**

Let us know how it goes and Merry Christmas!

[TazManiac]

Definitely continue with your fishless cycle and dont listen to the people that your wife is getting her information from. The tank does need to cycle and it will cycle either way, with or without fish, or should I say, with or without dead fish.

First thing to do before bothering to test your water again is to go and find a bottle of Pure Ammonia. It will probably be in the cleaning section of your local supermarket and will be labelled Ammonia. Shake it and see if it foams, if it does dont use it and find another source.

The cycle stuff your using will not add ammonia to your tank. It is designed to help add bacteria as far as I know.

Your water should not have ammonia in it to start with. Call your local water treatment company and let them know. 1ppm is quite a lot. Your finished cycle will take care of the ammonia for you once you finish but it should not be present in the first place.

You aren't going to be finished by Christmas but you wont have any dead fish to clean up on boxing day if you do this the right way.

Go to the store now and buy some ammonia. Your wasting your test kits if your not adding a source of ammonia.

If you cant find ammonia that doesnt foam then add a prawn (I think you call them shrimp in the USA) and put it in a hankerchief or similar to stop it floating around as it breaks up and stick it in the tank. You will have to endure a god awful smell with this option though.