Birth of a 29...start to finish

[greatXpectations]

As a few of you know, i have decided to start my first salt water tank. I have been doing lots of 'salt water homework' lately and finally started the construction phase. The purpose of this thread is so anyone interested can follow along, and toss suggestions out along the way.

I love taking pictures so there will be no shortage here!

Heres what i have so far...

29g tank
10g fuge
Custom stand, built at home
1.5" drain through bottom of the tank
Mag 9.5" doing the return duties through 3/4 lines
2 Korilla 1 pumps for extra flow
PS-55 Needle Wheel Protein Skimmer by AquaEuro USA
Custom canopy housing MH Phoenix 250W 14K bulb powered by Icecap


Crystal Sea salt
Refractometer
45LBS of LR (getting more soon)


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It should be interesting to look back on this thread from the beginning when i get the tank up and running!

[doug z]

Hey, another tank journal!

Good on ya, mate!

Hopefully William will give us our own section.. ;)

Looking good!

If I ever get into SW (not likely.. but impossible? Nay!) it'll be good to see how it's done...

[spudbuds]

Looks great so far. I'll be following along.

When you plumb your return, make sure to include a ball valve on the return line so you can adjust the flow. I think that Mag 9 is going to make the water fly through your sump.

Interesting plan on your overflow. Can you get a closeup pic of the top piece? I can't tell if it's opened on the top or if it's a cap with water going in under it. Are you planning on building any walls around it?

- Bill

[fins_n_fur]

Cool! I love these threads...get to learn more about a s/w tank set-up!

One question, as I'm thinking of building a two tank stand, how much room is there between the top of the bottom tank and the bottom of the opening in inches or cm. I'm trying to gauge the distance you need leave to be able to work in the bottom tank and to make the gap high enough.

[Kaylee]

This is going to be sooooo much fun thumbs2: :19:

[greatXpectations]

Cool! I love these threads...get to learn more about a s/w tank set-up!

One question, as I'm thinking of building a two tank stand, how much room is there between the top of the bottom tank and the bottom of the opening in inches or cm. I'm trying to gauge the distance you need leave to be able to work in the bottom tank and to make the gap high enough.


I hope this helps...there is enough room for me to do what i need to, and the skimmer i am getting is short so there shouldn't be any problems.

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[fins_n_fur]

Yes! Perfect! How tall are you and what is your build? Sorry to be more personal, but I'm a big guy and I struggle with my nano LOL and want to sure I give myself enough room to work.

[NickFish]

WOW! That is a beautiful stand!
Could you make one for my nano!

Can't wait to see how your tank comes along!

[greatXpectations]

Looks great so far. I'll be following along.

When you plumb your return, make sure to include a ball valve on the return line so you can adjust the flow. I think that Mag 9 is going to make the water fly through your sump.

Interesting plan on your overflow. Can you get a closeup pic of the top piece? I can't tell if it's opened on the top or if it's a cap with water going in under it. Are you planning on building any walls around it?

- Bill

On the return there will be a secondary/bypass line with a ball valve that will head back to the skimmer section of the sump...

I know the Mag is too big for the system but I got a good deal on it, and when i setup my 55g drum (holding tank) for S/W i will use it to keep the water stirring and put a mag 5 or something on the tank.


As far as the overflow goes, it is an adapter, 1.5" - 3" that is open at the top. I have not decided how i will set it up yet. I am trying to be creative with the adapter, hoping that it will calm the water down as it goes down the pipe. I don't know if i am building an overflow wall or not. I don't want to lose the "real estate" to an overflow unless i really need to.

Suggestions are always welcome :)

[greatXpectations]

WOW! That is a beautiful stand!
Could you make one for my nano!

Can't wait to see how your tank comes along!

Sure, but I'm sure shipping would be insane! Just wait until you see it with the front door on it. Its beautiful!


Yes! Perfect! How tall are you and what is your build? Sorry to be more personal, but I'm a big guy and I struggle with my nano LOL and want to sure I give myself enough room to work.

I'm between 5'8" and 5'10" depending on what convenience store i'm leaving but given your description, i would make it a couple inches taller. I imagine if i had bigger arms i would spit out a few choice words anytime i had to work on the sump. Come to think of it, i may anyways, lol. I am trying to prepare it well enough that i wont have to fool with the tank much, and i am setting it up so the fuge portion is easily accessible.

[fins_n_fur]

Sure, but I'm sure shipping would be insane! Just wait until you see it with the front door on it. Its beautiful!




I'm between 5'8" and 5'10" depending on what convenience store i'm leaving but given your description, i would make it a couple inches taller. I imagine if i had bigger arms i would spit out a few choice words anytime i had to work on the sump. Come to think of it, i may anyways, lol. I am trying to prepare it well enough that i wont have to fool with the tank much, and i am setting it up so the fuge portion is easily accessible.

Was that convenience store or bank? LOL Spitting a few choice words and joint dislocation is what I'm thinking will happen with 4.5 inches of room. I already thinking of padding the space above to protect my thick skull. Feedback is very much appreciated! Thanks!

[cocoa_pleco]

looks good!

[spudbuds]

On the return there will be a secondary/bypass line with a ball valve that will head back to the skimmer section of the sump...

I know the Mag is too big for the system but I got a good deal on it, and when i setup my 55g drum (holding tank) for S/W i will use it to keep the water stirring and put a mag 5 or something on the tank.
It's almost always better to go bigger anyway. It's easier to throttle back but impossible to speed up. Just wanted to make sure you were accounting for the pump being too big.

As far as the overflow goes, it is an adapter, 1.5" - 3" that is open at the top. I have not decided how i will set it up yet. I am trying to be creative with the adapter, hoping that it will calm the water down as it goes down the pipe. I don't know if i am building an overflow wall or not. I don't want to lose the "real estate" to an overflow unless i really need to.

Suggestions are always welcome :)
I have a couple of concerns with the overflow setup. The first is noise. I think it's going to sound like a toilet flushing all the time. The second (and most important) is how are you going to keep critters from going down the drain? It wouldn't take much for a snail to lodge itself in that tube and you'd have an instant flood. You'd need a strainer over the top and even then I think you'll get stuff stuck on it and eventually have a flood.

I'll have to give it some more thought, but I can't think of a good way to do it that will be safe long term without building walls around it. Once you have walls there are a couple of drain styles you could use to limit noise (durso being the most popular).

- Bill

[unleashed]

ditto with the above. you will need an overflow to prevent critters getting sucked down

[greatXpectations]

I would set it up so that nothing can get in...a removable screen or something like that.

I'm sure ill end up creating an overflow, i just didn't want to. I prob will remove the adapter and go with a durso setup as well...

Two ideas...

First, an overflow that is about 2" wide and just deep enough to house a durso downpipe. This would point to the front of the tank. Stack rocks on either side, and pretty much hide it.

Second, turn the downpipe to one side and make a wide but narrow overflow. It would end up being bigger than the first choice because i THINK i would make it center on the tank. I suppose i could have it off center. It will be mostly covered with rock anyways.

Speaking of rock, i transferred all my rock to the second tub. week two of "cooking". It already looks cleaner! Next week ill make another batch of S/W and move the rock back to the first tub.

Mag went in the mail today so i'm hoping to have all plumbing done before Monday. Korillas are supposed to go in the mail tomorrow so they should be here next week sometime.

[greatXpectations]

Ok, ive decided to redesign my return system. I dont want micro bubbles in the main tank and they are caused by high pressure systems. To prevent this from happening i am not going to use the return system as my main water movement. I am going to add two Korilla 1 water movers to do most of the work.

You can see in the latest picture that I have simplified the return plumbing, and i am going to get a much smaller pump.

Second, i have decided to give in and do a Durso setup. I modified the pipes so that they are closer together allowing me to make a smaller sump. The plumbing piece on the right side will be drilled a million times to create a strainer. Im not sure if ill use the strainer part or not because Im worried that it may just be asking for a clog.

You can learn more about this drain style here. Durso Stand Pipes ([Only Registered Users Can See Links.])



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[spudbuds]

Looks very nice. Good call on not using your return as your primary water movement. Instead of powerheads, you could do a closed loop. Just another option to consider. I use powerheads myself, but I've considered switching to a closed loop. Maybe someday.

A couple more questions on your plumbing.

Did you make the top of the durso adjustable? It looks kind of low which will make the water level in your display low.

Did you drill anti-siphon holes in the return lines near the where the water level will be? When the return pump is turned off, a siphon will start down the return lines. You want anti-siphon holes to break the siphon after the water drains a small amount.

I bet you didn't think you would end up being a master plumber when you started this project. :sbiggrin:

It's coming along great. Keep up the good work.
- Bill

[greatXpectations]

spudbuds,

The durso is not adjustable, but i am building an overflow to surround it so that will control the main tanks water level. Its only dry assembled at the moment so i can change it up if i want during water testing.

Thank you very much for the return line anti-siphon tip. You have probably saved me from a potentially MAJOR flood!

I would like to add a closed loop to it someday, with the wavemaker, but for now, ill stick to the Korillas, mainly because i paid 30 bucks for two of em.

I need to make the overflow piece, add the fuge internal walls, and wait for my pump to show up. Then I should be able to do the first water test!

[ILuvMyGoldBarb]

I just finally saw this thread. If you are planning to use the 10gal as a fuge, then something you need to consider very carefully is the amount of flow you will have in it. A refugium is not supposed to have a lot of flow in it. If you are using a Mag 9 and then having to put a bypass on it, you are going to have a lot of flow in that fuge. The purpose of the fuge is to create a low flow area for the production of pods and for keeping the water in contact with the macro algae long enough for it to do some good. I think you may find the mag 9 to be a bigger problem than you are anticipating.

[greatXpectations]

Yea, i have some ideas on how to minimize the flow in the fuge. Picture this...

Looking straight down at the tank, insert a T of baffles. the short end of the T splits the tank in half. Skimmer half and then the long end of the T splits the other half of the tank. One side is the fuge, with a seperate water entry and exit, and the last section is for the return pump.

Just a thought but i doubt ill be using the Mag 9 on this tank anyways, so ill probably build a traditional fuge...

[spudbuds]

Good call on the overflow walls. The top of the durso could have still been adjustable to minimize the noise of the water falling over the walls, but it will work fine the way you have it.

The T idea could work. What size return pump and skimmer are you planning? That will likely determine your spacing on the baffles. There are many ways to plumb the sump and everybody has a preference.

- Bill

[greatXpectations]

Here is the skimmer i have chosen. AquaEuro ([Only Registered Users Can See Links.]) I have done a lot of digging and asking on various boards and this one won the vote. It is an octopus look-a-like, coming out of the same factory. It was chosen due to price and height. Its one of the few skimmers that will fit under my short stand.

I drilled the anti siphon holes in the return lines and then glued everything together. I went over the plumbing with black "Fusion" spraypaint so the pipes blend into the background.

[spudbuds]

I'm not familiar with that brand of skimmer but it does look a lot like the Octopus line. If it performs like an Octopus, you'll be in good shape.

Sounds like things are moving along pretty well. Can't wait to see pics of the plumbing all painted.

Bill

[greatXpectations]

NO LEAKS! Now i have to get the overflow setup, and get the skimmer...then i can setup the baffles in the fuge.

[oldhead]

Not a bad skimmer but I suspect that you could do a bit better depending on how much coin you're willing to drop. Just keep in mind that a skimmer is extremely vital and the better you can drop in the water the happier you'll be in the grand scheme of things. That one is not bad though to get you started. I can't wait till I have the time to make my sump. I already have the tank I just need to get started and look into another skimmer. Good luck and post lots of pics! :18:

[greatXpectations]

So after running it for a while i don't like the return system. The durso seems to be doing fine now that i have the pump dialed in so return/drain equals out, but i don't like the flow coming from the return lines. It feels very weak, almost non existent.

I am thinking about dropping down to a 1/2" plumbing setup, with a Y at the middle of the back of the tank, rather than a T at the top. possibly less back pressure and higher pressure due to smaller pipe diameter.

Option two is to simplify the return system into one 3/4 line and rely on the Korillas until i setup a closed loop.

What do you think?

[greatXpectations]

Sooooooooooooooo...

I was doing my final pluming today, under the tank, i make one last adjustment and i hear that dreaded sound. **SNAP** The tank cracked at the bulkhead. I had just finished gluing all my pieces in place, so I have lost all of my return plumbing. AINT THAT A $*%&@

Anyways, i think I'm going to go with dual 1" bulkheads, one on each side of the tank, so one line goes direct to the fuge, and the other to the skimmer side. Return pump in the center.

[spudbuds]

Sorry, that's a bummer. Did the tank crack or just the the plumbing?

[greatXpectations]

The glass panel cracked.

I bought a new tank tonight, and ill drill it in the AM. I am going to use the 1.5d drain again, because i all ready have it, but im going to plumb it completely different this time. I dont feel like describing it at the moment, but there will be pictures when I get it setup. It will end up more efficient in the end, so....

still annoyed that i broke the glass though!

[spudbuds]

That is a bummer. Good luck with the new setup. Can't wait to see pics.

- Bill

[greatXpectations]

Ok...new tank is drilled, back panel painted black...again.

I am very happy with the way the new plumbing looks, and i cant wait to test it!

I have two of the sump dividers siliconed so far...im waiting for them to flash set so i can set the last two. I should be able to do a water test tomorrow afternoon.

I have also completely redesigned the return line. I am adding a SCWD wave maker to the mix and bringing the return lines closer together.

My water movers are here so I am happy about that...

Things are coming along nicely...again.

[greatXpectations]

Good news...i decided to make my own overflow silencer. It is similar to current designs, but with a twist.

First, i got a 1.5" - 3" adapter, a 3" Cap, and the 1.5" thread - slip adapter that screws into the bulkhead.

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I cut the adapter in half exposing the ribs of the adapter.

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The way this works is the water flows up to the overflow pipe through the ribs. The cap slips over the adapter, not glued, and i put a 3/16" hole in the top to relieve vacuum pressure.

Once i got the return to overflow ratio set via the valve on the return pump I set the cap on and its silent!

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Its clean, compact, simple, and quiet. What more can you ask for in an overflow?

[greatXpectations]

OK, so i decided to make my own overflow silencer. It is similar to current designs, but with a twist.

First, i got a 1.5" - 3" adapter, a 3" Cap, and the 1.5" thread - slip adapter that screws into the bulkhead.

[Only Registered Users Can See Links.]

I cut the adapter in half exposing the ribs of the adapter.

[Only Registered Users Can See Links.]

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The way this works is the water flows up to the overflow pipe through the ribs. The cap slips over the adapter, not glued, and i put a 3/16" hole in the top to relieve vacuum pressure.

Once i got the return to overflow ratio set via the valve on the return pump I set the cap on and its silent!

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Here you can see where the water level sits with the cap on. Once i get the overflow in place the display tank will be full.

Its clean, compact, simple, and quiet. What more can you ask for in an overflow?

[spudbuds]

Looks great! Unique and effective.

- Bill

[greatXpectations]

I built the door to the cabinet today... It will not have hinges; instead it will come off completely for full access to the fuge.

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Ill start on the canopy soon!

[greatXpectations]

well folks, ive been a busy bee the last few days!

I molded a piece of 1/4" acrylic around a 4" tube, making a half pipe, cut it to depth, cut teeth in the top and siliconed it to the back of the tank creating my overflow. My custom overflow idea is working perfectly...it is dead silent!

The handle is on the front panel, and so are the magnetic holders in each corner, allowing me to completely remove the panel for access. I did it this way because the tank is next to my bed and there isnt much room to move around.

OK, on to the real news...ITS FULL OF WATER! I filled it tonight, and its running perfectly! My wavemaker is creating a nice random stream, switching sides every 10 seconds or so...the korilias are pushing water around the tank nicely as well.

My first two fish, a pair of black Percula Clowns will be here in about a week...

I am going to the LFS tomorrow to get a bucket of live sand, and a fresh piece of LR to start seeding this thing.

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Cheap, cold cathode neon tubes that normally go in a computer case. I rigged a 12v adapter to them, and they are working great!

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You could barely hear the water flowing down the drain through the air vent, so i stuck some air line tubing in there....SILENT!



Next project on the list is to build the canopy...then Ill get the MH (metal halide lights) in there.

[spudbuds]

Looks great! Congrats on getting the water flowing. It's all down hill from there. :sbiggrin:

- Bill

[greatXpectations]

Well, there hasn't been too much excitement with the tank since I've been letting it stabilize, but I added "Rocky and Adrian" last night... The clowns Ive wanted since day one :)

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[oldhead]

Very nice job, tank is looking great! BTW what silicone did you use to glue the dividers? Thanks.