dwarf puffer

[Kaga's Kritters]

i got a dwarf puffer the other day.....guess i should have done some reading first, lol. found out they are pretty aggressive little buggers. he is in my 10g community tank right now. he is pretty shy and timid at the moment, and is about the size of a pea. do you think it would be better to have more than one? would that cut down on the aggression towards the other fish in the tank? or will i just have to give him his own tank when he gets bigger? he is so cute though!

[CAF]

DPs are a species only type critter.... Definately his own tank and soon!

[YaYgoldFish]

Hes going to need his own 10g and your guna have to start breeding your own snails to give him once a while to make sure his teeth don get too large.Goodluck with the fish and DP being together lol.

[Kaga's Kritters]

i dont have the room to breed snails. and i really dont want a 10 with only one fish in it either. maybe i will see if i can sell him or give him back to the lfs. i really like puffers but they all seem to be so mean. is their any kind of puffer that isn't very vicious?

[Kaga's Kritters]

i think i know what I am going to do. i've been doing some reading and I think im going to turn my 10g intoa dwarf puffer tank. i can move the other fish to my 29g. I read that they need 2-3 gal per puffer, so I can put 3-5 in my 10 gal. that will give me enough in there to keep it active. and it said they can eat black worms and ghost shrimp, which both i can get....and see if i can find some baby snails anywhere once in awhile for them too. what kind of snails are easy to breed that they would eat? i already have an oto in the tank and a mystery snail. it says they usually leave otocinclus alone, so he will be ok, what about the snail i already have?

[markbob]

Hold on, slow your roll there man. You posted about this in another area and I posted a link for you that talks about the dwarfs. According to the Arizona Aquatic garden the dwarfs are the only puffer spieces that is a community fish. It seems odd but I have actually seen it in action. I saw one shop put a whole mess of them into a tank with other fish and they were fine. The other puffers like the figure 8 and green or spotted are aggressive and they are definately a spieces only andrequire a minimum of 20g per fish. I've seen the results of the aggressive puffers in a tank and they will kill eachother and everything else. Here's the link [Only Registered Users Can See Links.] . They are about half way down the page. It actually says to keep them in large groups.

[Kaga's Kritters]

everywhere else i read about them says they are aggressive.

and i dont remember posting about these before, i just got this one.

[markbob]

Sorry, it must have been some one else. Just give him a chance in there and see how he does but I would be willing to bet that you wont have any problems with him and he may be even happier if he has some friends. I know that there's stuff out there that calls them aggressive but I have seen a school of them chillin like tetras. If he starts to act up you can always move him

[Kaga's Kritters]

k, he does seem pretty shy. i am planning on getting him some buddies in a day or so.

[Phitz]

k, he does seem pretty shy. i am planning on getting him some buddies in a day or so.

I have done my research on DP's because I have wanted one for about a month and a half now. 3g per is a fairly crammed tank, recommended is 5. You could get 3 in there and be fine as long as it is heavily planted(they require that anyway though). They are fine in communities while young but when they get older they demand thier space. Other than that you know what to do, you are more experienced with keeping fish than I am :ezpi_wink1:

Just remember that they are VERY messy eaters.

[Fishalicious]

DP's are defo not community fish! So I am over the moon to see you are getting the little guy his own space (bet your other fish are thanking you too hehehe) I have see 1 little DP shred a whole tank to pieces in 5 days including angelfish at a friends house (the little DP is now swimming here happily in his own tank :malelovies: ) DP's don't really need any 'friends' in the wild they are solitary as well... if you buy more just make sure it is heavily planted as Phitz said.

The only puffer that can be kept in a community tank and is the least aggressive freshwater puffer is the Figure 8

[kimmers318]

After keeping dp's.....and several other FW puffs, I would not recommend more than 3 in a 10 gal. At that stocking watch your water carefully as they are messy and the nitrates can build up quickly.
As to aggression.....each puff is an individual. Dp's are notorious for being fin nippers and I think you will soon see that change as your little one starts to get comfortable and older. Yes, there have been some dp's that have lived in harmony with other fish, but that is not the norm. My dp's live with an amano shrimp.....which is really odd, but will rip the fins off of other fish. Trying them with other fish is okay as long as you are ready willing and able to rehome someone if it doesn't work out.

[markbob]

how's he doing so far? Did you move him or is he still behaving himself in the first tank?

[Kaga's Kritters]

he's still in with the fish and doing ok. he did start bugging the cories so i moved them to the other tank. if he starts going after the other fish i will move them too.


could a dwarf puffer live with a figure 8?

[Phitz]

he's still in with the fish and doing ok. he did start bugging the cories so i moved them to the other tank. if he starts going after the other fish i will move them too.


could a dwarf puffer live with a figure 8?
A figure eight is brackish, DP are freshwater. Other than that I'm not sure about the size of them alone, F8 usually need close to 10g anyways. Look in to green spotted puffers if you want two different puffers(I have not so I'm notsure about compatibility). Two DP in a 10g should do fine though.

[Fishalicious]

Here we go... this is a discussion I have so frequently :c12:

The Figure Eight Puffer is not a brakish puffer - in nature they are found in freshwater (check science papers on this fish) - I have bred Figure Eights in freshwater and only ever kept them this way they are however larger and need a lot more space than a DP.

Green spotted puffers are born in fresh but migrate to brakish waters as they get older and later in life even sometimes migrate right into sea water.

I wouldn't mix a DP with any other puffers - they are territorial towards their own and I'm afraid a larger puffer might cause some fights.

Puffers have such huge characters that you will not miss any other fish not being in there....

Why not get a male and 2 females? Once they start breeding they are like guppies and not that hard to breed as people believe..

Remember to get that snail farm going ;) ;)

[Kaga's Kritters]

what kind of snails?

[CAF]

How do sex puffers? I have always loved puffers of all types, and kept a few over the years. I would absoultely love to breed DPs....

I will agree that the figure eight is a freshwater puffer, however I have found in my personal expierence that they seem to have less fungal and ich problems in slightly brackish water.

[Fishalicious]

DP's will eat all kind of aquatic snails except the Malaysian Trumpet snail (they are too hard for them) Look for Ramshorns or Mystery Snails (your local fish store will probably even give you them for free) They are also fond of baby apple snails.

Juveniles are hard to sex but once adult it is really easy

The males have a dark line that runs down their belly (their bellies have more yellow coloring as well). The vertical line on the males darkens with sexual maturity and during spawning. The males also have lines or "wrinkles" behind their eyes that the females do not have.

I also usually notice that the males spots are stronger and in females more blurry.

[Kaga's Kritters]

i have some mystery snails in my tanks already. havent seen any ramshorns for sale anywhere. how do u breed myster snails? are ramshorns easier to breed?

[CAF]

DP's will eat all kind of aquatic snails except the Malaysian Trumpet snail (they are too hard for them) Look for Ramshorns or Mystery Snails (your local fish store will probably even give you them for free) They are also fond of baby apple snails.

Juveniles are hard to sex but once adult it is really easy

The males have a dark line that runs down their belly (their bellies have more yellow coloring as well). The vertical line on the males darkens with sexual maturity and during spawning. The males also have lines or "wrinkles" behind their eyes that the females do not have.

I also usually notice that the males spots are stronger and in females more blurry.


Thanks!!!! (now I just need to convince the wife why I NEED to set up another tank...)

[markbob]

Good luck on that. That'll probably be the hardest part.thumbs2:

[CAF]

You dont know the half of it.... she is trying to get tanks down and consoldated and I keep bringing home new stuff and have to put one back up LOL

[markbob]

At least your not trapped in the 20gal limit hell that I am. I am so tired of renting but it doesn't make sense to buy a house now to move out in two years. but as soon as I own I will have multiple large tanks too.

[kimmers318]

Fishalicious, I too have read and seen debates on forums about the fig8 actually being a FW puffer in it's natural environment and the brackish followers seem to think that a low end brackish is providing the necessary hardness and minerals as apparently their environment is extremely hard water.....more than anything we are used to with our treated tap waters. Do you feel there is any truth to that thought and maybe that is why they seem to do better in most environments with a little brackish touch?

[Fishalicious]

Fig8's are found in Indochina, Malaysia and Indonesia the waters they are found in have water parameters ranging from pH range: 6.5 – 7.5; dH range: 5 - 12 So I don't believe that they are really seen as hard water fish....

I have no doubt that they can live happily in brackish but it must be stressed that if kept in brackish it is very low end I wouldn't go above a salinity of 1.005

It comes down to each individuals experience with them... I have bred with them and have only kept them in freshwater at a neutral PH of 7 and they are extremely happy - if my fish are happy and breeding then I am not going to change their living conditions - My oldest which I bought 8 years ago is still with me ...

I guess this is one of those arguments which are going to be around for a long time but seeing peeps keep them at both in fresh and brakish it is obvious they are both an option.... if fish could talk then they would be able to tell us what they prefer ;) ;) ;)

[kimmers318]

Wouldn't that be nice if they could talk to us! I will not be setting up any new tanks anytime soon, but someday I plan on have a group of fig 8's and plan on trying FW and seeing how it goes, knowing that if they start to show signs of not being happy I can raise the salinity a little and see if that helps.
I have pretty hard water with a higher ph (7.6 or so) and have to use a mineralizer on the pool to help pull some of it out so we shall see.
This is probably a debate that will never end, there will always be 2 opinions, and everyone will always think theirs is right of course.